Tournaments: How to increase participation?

[Grisu]

@lizard skunkbelly did sich tournaments some years ago (pass it on tournaments IIRC). The idea back then was to be the last one standing though, so people tried to sabotage the build before passing on the character

Yout idea sounds more like an informal collaboration like "hey, once you completed Act I, givee your character. I have plenty of time the next week."?

You'd probably need trade profiles for that though, @maxicek?

 

[Gripphon]

Change of life priorities pretty much. I play PvP few hours a week and that is all the fun I need in videogaming Dropped all other games completely.

 

[Gift]

Lurker here, but sometimes chat in discord: never participated in a tourney, but am interested.

Like above points it comes down to time/commitment required. Shorter end goals or long term tourneys are likely something I'd go with. I just haven't dived too much into the long term ones yet.

 

[D2DC]

How about a co-op/trading tournament. I love me some SPF trading.

1. Entrants get grouped into teams of four.

2. Each team member must use only items traded to them from other team members (maybe starting after Blood Raven/mausoleum?)

3. Once beating hell difficulty, we could have a mini team MFO competition, say 5 hours from each team member = 20 hour set team entry.

 

[ffs]

Yeah personal goals and projects can get in the way of tournaments, but it kinda depends on the type of tournament as well.

From what I see there's usually very good participation in the bigger "farming" tournaments like RFL and MFO. We also had several mixed MF/RF tourneys in recent years where many people ran. So things are good on this end IMO. Btw @PhineasB I hope you have your RFL hosting responsibilities on the radar!

Then there's the restriction-based "special progression rules" type of tournaments, those are quite different and to me it seems they tend to appeal to a smaller player base from the outset. In some way they are more "casual" but at the same time they tend to be time-consuming.

I think apart from personal style, a major factor is the difference in yield as well, and generally how people choose to spend limited gaming time. Spending 10-20 hours in D2 can mean either (1) getting another character who beat the game, however difficult or interesting it was to do that, or (2) getting 10+ high runes or something like Griffon's, DFathom or DWeb, charms, crafts.... As the player base grows older, adult life, jobs, often families etc, my impression is there's just a tendency to go with option (2) and get something "more useful" out of the valuable time spent on the game.

 

[HanShotFirst]

I think apart from personal style, a major factor is the difference in yield as well, and generally how people choose to spend limited gaming time. Spending 10-20 hours in D2 can mean either (1) getting another character who beat the game, however difficult or interesting it was to do that, or (2) getting 10+ high runes or something like Griffon's, DFathom or DWeb, charms, crafts.... As the player base grows older, adult life, jobs, often families etc, my impression is there's just a tendency to go with option (2) and get something "more useful" out of the valuable time spent on the game.

Yes! This. I couldn't have said it better!

 

[Arjan]

I haven't really ever participated in any tournaments. Usually I'll take a look through the rules and they seem like I can't just hop in and get going after work. there's all sorts of complicated things I have to watch out for while playing through like after every act I gotta do some stuff and have someone roll for something and switch what I'm doing or take off some gear or any number of things and I kinda just look at the rules for a bit and then leave . Too stressful. Plus I got a tiny lizard brain.

I guess I'd like to do something with people. Real life always hits real hard though. I've signed up for and dropped out of mfos in the past and those are about as simple as they get. I dropped just because real life stuff. So I'm not sure if this thread really applies to me but I like the idea of something simple.

This sums it up for me too. Either the rules are too demanding or the timeframe is just too short for me. It’s hard to make enough free time to actually feel I could participate for anything more then just for fun.

And it feels I should get my game up way more before I try to doing HC or you’re out upon death. I understand why the rule is necessary, I just ain’t good enough yet.

 

[Excalibur]

A free Rune/Magic Find Tournament has always been successful because it allows you to be on track in your current goals and just gives you a motivation to play. Anything else feels too demanding, stressful and sometimes (for me) waste of time.

 

[Babyhell]

sometimes (for me) waste of time

This.

 

[Vang]

This sums it up for me too. Either the rules are too demanding or the timeframe is just too short for me. It’s hard to make enough free time to actually feel I could participate for anything more then just for fun.

And it feels I should get my game up way more before I try to doing HC or you’re out upon death. I understand why the rule is necessary, I just ain’t good enough yet.

I tried to remedy that with my Apprehensive Adventurer tournament by making it SC and points. If you farmed enough, you could take first pretty effectively. Though I will admit, the item/town restrictions turned people off.

With that said, Arjan you mentioned to participate for anything more than just fun of it. How could we expand?

I have a master's in mental health and worked with kids for a couple of years, so I totally understand reward structure, time management, and the need to have a purpose in doing something:

Generally, I asked myself questions before partaking in anything not just D2:

What is the purpose of my activity? Usually to have fun, better myself/family, sense of accomplishment etc.
Does the above activity fill a need or want? If Yes, continue, if no well think of something else.
And lastly which @ffs pointed out: Could I be doing something more enjoyable to fill that time to achieve the first question and not feel I wasted time? (In the case of D2 as pointed out: I can get some cool HRs/grailers or I can maybe get a tournament character all the way to Act5 NM investing all that time, not finding anything and biting the dust, option 1 please!) Additionally, you now know why you have a pile of laundry to do,

@D2DC Going to work on getting a unified tournament rules together to make those happen!

Thanks to the added replies!

 

[D2DC]

@D2DC Going to work on getting a unified tournament rules together to make those happen!

You all know best on rules! I've seen you use a point system before. 1-pt for every item per act used that came from a teammate? I'd love to play in some sort of trading tournament though!

 

[d2lover]

I've got an idea, but I don't know if you can make a tournament out of it:

Teleport is banned

you must run/walk from the camp to the jail as fast as you can.
you may attack if something is in way

townportals are not allowed for this one, also no waypoints, if you are in a bad spot and get killed, the challenge is over (you may try again).

Any other skills are allowed. (maybe ban dragonflight too?)

Every challenge you start, must be with a brand new map(change difficulty).

The challenge must be done in hell.

Potions are allowed, except stamina potions.

 

[Vang]

I've got an idea, but I don't know if you can make a tournament out of it:

Teleport is banned

you must run/walk from the camp to the jail as fast as you can.
you may attack if something is in way

townportals are not allowed for this one, also no waypoints, if you are in a bad spot and get killed, the challenge is over (you may try again).

Any other skills are allowed. (maybe ban dragonflight too?)

Every challenge you start, must be with a brand new map(change difficulty).

The challenge must be done in hell.

Potions are allowed, except stamina potions.

I think something like that would fall in the lines of a timed tournament. I like the idea and would participate in that one (maybe separate it by class as on my Harmony wielding BoS Assassin I move quite fast.) Maybe for this get an idea of monthly "speed runs" with a yearly winner per class.

 

[LouB]

That sounds interesting. I can see separating by class. frenzy barbs win for barbs, chargerdins for paladins. what about running with zero FRW?

 

[Nona]

Just some thoughts...

I would echo what others have said. I'm older now and time on video games competes with so many other things. I also think rules can be a barrier. A third thing is that there are so many incredibly good players with a lot of wealth and knowledge of the game here at the SPF. It's one of the best things about it but some way to equalize that would encourage me more to participate. I will never achieve run times like the fastest forum members here. I also won't know who to shop what for when, or what to craft for my character or what rares and magical items I should be checking. Nano posted in the TC3 tourney some tips for getting MF gear. I never had gambled at the Act 2 NPC (Elix or something?) before and I have played this game off and on for 20 years! Having those tips really improved my character and has made the tourney more fun. I know some people really like the competition part of these, but I find it just as exciting to cheer people on and help them as best I can. I think generally it has always been pretty friendly competition around here.

The main reason we are here and keep coming back is because of our relationships with other people on the forum and our love for this game. Having tournaments help foster those relationships will also help with participation.

Finally, it may be a numbers thing too. How many active members are here? How many do you need to participate for you to feel like you are getting good participation?

A couple of tourney related ideas...I think if you "win"a tourny (however it is defined) It would be nice if you could get some extra bling on your posts here in the spf...like a moderator could give you a trophy or graphic or something to show you achieved the goal you were after that could rest in your signature or wherever. A little badge for UT99er, or random tournament win, or MFO 2021 win, etc. We all like collecting here right?

I also was thinking about how could one manipulate things outside of the game to increase the challenge and fun. Like having to play through ACT 1 with the RMB and LMB reversed, or your hotkeys are randomly assigned, or you need to place a piece of paper over 1/4 of your screen, etc... I'm getting older and things don't work as well...it could be a geriatric tournament, or you create a Deckard Cain type character who's finally fed up with having to ID things so much that he/she sets off on their own adventure with the above limitations.

 

[Vang]

A couple of tourney related ideas...I think if you "win"a tourny (however it is defined) It would be nice if you could get some extra bling on your posts here in the spf...like a moderator could give you a trophy or graphic or something to show you achieved the goal you were after that could rest in your signature or wherever. A little badge for UT99er, or random tournament win, or MFO 2021 win, etc. We all like collecting here right?

Working on this actually!

 

[HanShotFirst]

Edit: I'd describe myself as a 'sometimes tournament player'.

Okay. I've given this some thought. I actually dug up my first post in a tournament (back in 2009), and I think I've got a pretty good handle on what motivates me.

For me, I think the most important factor when deciding whether or not to join a tournament is STORY. If you say we're going to restrict X, Y, and Z things just to make the game hard ... I'm probably not going to be very interested. But if you say we're going to restrict X, Y, and Z things because of some nifty narrative that's been created ... I'm much more likely to join. A good backstory always gets my creative juices flowing and gets me wanting to create a character to engage with this new world that has been envisioned. Me and my new character, off on a fresh adventure, through uncharted game play!

So, along those lines, things I really don't like:

1) Forced respecs.
2) Forced RNG use.

I know that respecs have been part of the game for more than a decade now, but I still haven't warmed to them. For me, respecing a character ruins their identity and basically breaks any narrative that may have been created for the character's journey.

Similarly, I haven't seen RNG use incorporated into any sort of narrative. It always seem to be: We're using an RNG, because we're using an RNG. It'll make things hard ... and hard is automatically interesting ... I guess ... *shrug*

Anyhow, it could just be me ... and since no one else has said something similar, I'd say there's a very real chance that it might be ... but, if the tournament host can create some sort of compelling story or reason for the restrictions, I'm willing to consider most anything. If the restrictions seem totally random, that's not going to ignite my imagination and get me to join.

As to specific tournament ideas that have been floated, I'd be most interested in joining a Green with envy tournament. The timing just seems right for that one with D2R patch 2.4 about to go live. The tweaks to set bonuses, and being able to upgrade set items, isn't super interesting as far as my regular characters are concerned, but, it could be super fun to engage with those changes in a tournament!

(Yep, I'm like 95% sold on putting down my UT99er for a bit to do that tournament. Now, someone pitch me a story as to why we're only using set items, and I'm all in! )

 

[Babyhell]

Similarly, I haven't seen RNG use incorporated into any sort of narrative

Yet. But imo this covers this particular field, your thoughts? Maybe something could be updated in a forthcoming edition to include some more players?

Any feedback/suggestion would be appreciated, if you feel so

 

[Flan]

In one of the very early tourneys, maybe even the first from bigfoot, one of the requirements was you had to kill Kaa the Soulless in all difficulties. He was an MSLE that most sane people avoided, but had to take him out. Things like this can also take a tourney with not a lot of complex rules and definitely spice it up.

As for me, I ran into time issues like others and had to prioritize my goals. I would like to have another run at some tourneys, but they can't be too constraining because it becomes a slog instead of being fun.

 

[HanShotFirst]

Yet. But imo this covers this particular field, your thoughts?

I stand corrected. I suppose the line: 'Fighting evil is not without consequences... each victory has a cost.' is as good a reason as any ...

And, nope. No suggestions . It looks like fun. If I hadn't been at the one month mark with my UT99er I probably would have joined when you launched the tournament. Now things have settled down with my UT99er (I have all my endgame gear except a Torch), but I'm now 18 pages behind on your tournament. For me, it was just bad timing .