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Vessel of Hatred

[won by mafia] 2d3 game normal, no lore, just lynching [Game Thread]

And I honestly see no room for any in depth analysis on this D1 without including past games and behaviours, which I don't particularly like.
Maybe aside from BH's analysis which I think was more of a disservice to the town. That is basically the only original that has happened in just this game, which says a lot about D1's in general.
 
Zhao_Yue said:
Help me understand your logic, pyro coasted last game hence that generates suspicion this game?

Noticed you didn't mention slippery Skjolde, is he relegated to honorable mention status now?


So you choose 7 out of 9 players, pretty generalized, I guess you didn't want to commit to 1 or 2?
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Commit on day 1 to one or two targets? Well...don't see how it is possible at that point. Voting matters...

And I gave 8 names. Only Noodle is who he is and don't ask me to have any read on him...maybe ever oO

Only one that is not fairly evaluated is coju. But he is always scum in my mind, at least as much as D2DC is town on his own. So well...can't tell.
 
Zhao_Yue said:
Help me understand your logic, pyro coasted last game hence that generates suspicion this game?

Noticed you didn't mention slippery Skjolde, is he relegated to honorable mention status now?
Click to expand...
I think Pyro has been coasting in quite a few games lately. So, it's probably just declining time/interest for forum mafia.

The Christmas game, he did show up when summoned and became more active at crunch time. So, it's possible if we put some pressure on him, we'll get more participation out of him.

Like I said, he's a good townie to have around, IF he's around. If he's just coasting, he could be doing that as scum or because he's not motivated to play. Both scenarios aren't exactly helpful to town.
 
Babyhell said:
False.

Read statement about Pyro.

And I put myself, as asked, in the shoes of scums. They know who is who apart from the power roles. But maybe after saying I was wrong about stating obvious things at the start you will push on me because I didn't went far enough this time?

I mean...come on. Either there's still some salt from a past crusade (wait...did anyone say that we should not consider previous games while thinking about this one? But I'm ok with that, that's the gameS), or if you're town you're putting emphasis on the fact that I answered Zhao. Yeepee...

Anyway. Doing so you're starting to turn suspicious to me, but I won't follow that route for now. However Pyro and you seemed to have - yes, previous game again - the capability to read one another. IMO that could be beneficial to keep you both alive a day or two and see what happens.

Back to your initial remark: at that time when I posted at least, given the current read I had in the few minutes I had to throw an answer before basically now - and I need a rest, the meeting this morning was a success but very tiring, a lot of work those last two days - I don't see me stating something else.

However, being confident with my...way to do things (not saying if I'm wrong or right, I am on either side depending of the moment), asking me can put a focus on you, so maybe Zhao grabbed a pinch of scumminess doing so... but here again, as of now, nothing strong nor definitive.

Feel free to lynch me, but I'm town.
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So that's a weird thing to say. D2DC is suspicious so instead of following up with more probing/discussion, you back off. I'm getting the impression that you're saying that not because you think D2DC is mafia. It's because he was hitting a little too close to home and things were starting to get dicey for you.

Same for me. I ask you a simple question and it puts you in a bad light, so I'm also suspicious (pinched sized). I'm definitely entering that in my charts. With footnotes.

@Skjolde

"Feel free to lynch me, but I'm town."

How do you rate that meme compared to the one below?

"Lynch Person A today and if he turns up town, you can lynch me tomorrow."
 
Skjolde said:
And I honestly see no room for any in depth analysis on this D1 without including past games and behaviours, which I don't particularly like.
Maybe aside from BH's analysis which I think was more of a disservice to the town. That is basically the only original that has happened in just this game, which says a lot about D1's in general.
Click to expand...
Well my analysis, at least the one asked by Zhao, can be seen either way, as from a scum point of view. Or if you think I'm hiding doing so as a scum, you can lynch me and be disappointed.

What I see is that amongst our possible power roles, we have doctor, cop, tracker...trying to find targets can help those with power roles to chose their night targets and build their first moves.

Maybe that's unusual, I must admit not as much experience as you all, but well...alright, that could be of interest for scums. But also for townies with roles.

I understand that's a risk, but by how does that unbalance things towards the 7/9 chances of townie lynch on day 1?
 
Zhao_Yue said:
So that's a weird thing to say. D2DC is suspicious so instead of following up with more probing/discussion, you back off. I'm getting the impression that you're saying that not because you think D2DC is mafia. It's because he was hitting a little too close to home and things were starting to get dicey for you.

Same for me. I ask you a simple question and it puts you in a bad light, so I'm also suspicious (pinched sized). I'm definitely entering that in my charts. With footnotes.

@Skjolde

"Feel free to lynch me, but I'm town."

How do you rate that meme compared to the one below?

"Lynch Person A today and if he turns up town, you can lynch me tomorrow."
Click to expand...
I much more hate the second meme you presented. It creates such a "Oh, this person seems so certain, so it must be true", when in fact most of the time, none of us no anything for certain.

I could understand the use of that meme, if the person saying it had done some real heavy analysis. I mean, you can still disagree with said persons analysis, but you gotta respect the hustle and maybe that he or she is so certain, that they vomit out a meme like that. But no, I normally don't like it.

Generally these memes only really bother me if they stand on their own without any arguments or analysis.
 
Zhao_Yue said:
So that's a weird thing to say. D2DC is suspicious so instead of following up with more probing/discussion, you back off. I'm getting the impression that you're saying that not because you think D2DC is mafia. It's because he was hitting a little too close to home and things were starting to get dicey for you.

Same for me. I ask you a simple question and it puts you in a bad light, so I'm also suspicious (pinched sized). I'm definitely entering that in my charts. With footnotes.
Click to expand...
I am answering with the given situation, I can't invent things that don't exist.

If D2DC remarks are valid, then as a person that asked, you could grab that pinch of scumminess, right?

For the first part, see my previous post. The fact of not trying to share thoughts on day 1 can be seen either way in my noobie book. That's why I can build a personal view on D2DC that could be different from town.

But as stated, that could go either way.

I add that as a scum, I may have taken those warnings into account and act more as a "good boy townie" to hide a bit. That is not my choice.
 
Babyhell said:
Well my analysis, at least the one asked by Zhao, can be seen either way, as from a scum point of view. Or if you think I'm hiding doing so as a scum, you can lynch me and be disappointed.

What I see is that amongst our possible power roles, we have doctor, cop, tracker...trying to find targets can help those with power roles to chose their night targets and build their first moves.

Maybe that's unusual, I must admit not as much experience as you all, but well...alright, that could be of interest for scums. But also for townies with roles.

I understand that's a risk, but by how does that unbalance things towards the 7/9 chances of townie lynch on day 1?
Click to expand...
Is a D1 lynch always bad?
 
D2DC said:
I think Pyro has been coasting in quite a few games lately. So, it's probably just declining time/interest for forum mafia.

The Christmas game, he did show up when summoned and became more active at crunch time. So, it's possible if we put some pressure on him, we'll get more participation out of him.

Like I said, he's a good townie to have around, IF he's around. If he's just coasting, he could be doing that as scum or because he's not motivated to play. Both scenarios aren't exactly helpful to town.
Click to expand...

*Cue ramblings*
Its a combination of things and you probably aren't wrong, my mafia prime days are probably long past by now. I figured I could give myself a go back into the games since they seem to be taking off again and was hoping to get myself back into the swing of them. That being said, I've now been in two games (die hard and yours) and I did coast. I probably actually contributed more to the scum night chat in the die hard game than I did in the actual game thread which is sad really. If I don't get myself back into the swing of things after this game maybe I'll have to hang the hat on the hat post for a while again, or maybe switch to moderating since I don't have to actually actively participate other than vote counts and setup.
*End ramblings*

I just did another read of the thread just now, and even though I voted for babyhell out of the gate as a joke, I think I like where my vote is currently. Let me pick up a couple of quotes here in a bit.
 
snickersnack said:
Is a D1 lynch always bad?
Click to expand...
No, I didn't say that. I just said that sharing analysis given our possible power roles can be useful for them (or us if I have an ability). And I don't see how it goes against the probability given the random day 1 lynch situation.
 
Pyrotechnician said:
*Cue ramblings*
Its a combination of things and you probably aren't wrong, my mafia prime days are probably long past by now. I figured I could give myself a go back into the games since they seem to be taking off again and was hoping to get myself back into the swing of them. That being said, I've now been in two games (die hard and yours) and I did coast. I probably actually contributed more to the scum night chat in the die hard game than I did in the actual game thread which is sad really. If I don't get myself back into the swing of things after this game maybe I'll have to hang the hat on the hat post for a while again, or maybe switch to moderating since I don't have to actually actively participate other than vote counts and setup.
*End ramblings*

I just did another read of the thread just now, and even though I voted for babyhell out of the gate as a joke, I think I like where my vote is currently. Let me pick up a couple of quotes here in a bit.
Click to expand...
See. You just have to poke him a bit. :LOL:
 
Babyhell said:
No, I didn't say that. I just said that sharing analysis given our possible power roles can be useful for them (or us if I have an ability). And I don't see how it goes against the probability given the random day 1 lynch situation.
Click to expand...
Okay, so the 7/9 chance is for a bad outcome? I'm just trying to be clear on whether that 7/9 is good or bad for you here.
 
Pyrotechnician said:
even though I voted for babyhell out of the gate as a joke, I think I like where my vote is currently. Let me pick up a couple of quotes here in a bit
Click to expand...
Do what you think is right.

Maybe I'm not yet set into an usual gameplay (if I ever do), and that will set me in a day 1 lynch situation. Good.

We learn from each other gameplay doing games, right? So you'll learn from me anyway, either by keeping or lynching me.

Vote ends tomorrow. We will see by then, maybe I'm locked beforehand?

All I can tell is that my full reveal won't give you much information on possible scums power role.
 
snickersnack said:
Okay, so the 7/9 chance is for a bad outcome? I'm just trying to be clear on whether that 7/9 is good or bad for you here.
Click to expand...
7 townies out of 9 players. And Day 1 lynch is considered a good thing, and I agreed with the reasons on previous games. I am for a day 1 lynch.

What I meant is that any shared analysis can help any power role to take his decision. Granted, same for scums, but then it's a gamble situation: will the analysis be followed, countered, by one side or both...that just can't be analyzed.
 
Random first thought that no longer applies, not reading your role pm is just rediculous. I know it was probably meant as a joke, but just to put it out there this shouldn't be considered a strategy for the game. Lets just keep that out of play overall.

Babyhell said:
On my side, I am either Townie, Jailkeeper, Cop or Doctor.

I am not Mafia, and I have no piece of info stating what are Mafia roles.
Click to expand...

D2DC said:
I looked at all the possibilities as well. However, I figure it's not really beneficial to discuss.
  • Mafia know it's 1/3 scenarios, and have much more of an interest in figuring out which setup they're up against.
  • Town PRs can simply look at the chart and make any inferences based on what role they have.
  • VTs can speculate all they want, but should know that drawing out any info is only gonna help team scum.
Your "helpful" posts looks more like PR hunting to me.

Vote: Babyhell
Click to expand...

I'm very intrigued by the post by Babyhell above, why did you specify that you were townie, jailkeeper, cop, or doctor. There are other town power roles that are listed in the setup, it just seems very odd that you would either specifically mention those 3 or specifically exclude the other possibilites.

Second post by D2DC, discussing setup is a detriment (fancy words) for the town. Mafia already know the setups are limited to a specific subset of roles based on the roles that they have. Speculating will likely only narrow down the possibilities further for them since they already have more information than we do. Not a good option to pursue.
 
Babyhell said:
D2DC pointing towards Noodle's non-confirmation is somewhat what happened with Pyro being inactive last game. It cost coju his life due to him trying to say not to vote for Pyro.

Just asking him not to do it again, and get himself to D2.

However I have to vote for him not to be suspected of the same thing, i.e. protecting someone I know of.

I mean that blew the previous game somehow - or made it interesting, as you wish - but that start was based upon a misread of a mistake.

Do we really want it to happen again?

Me no. Hence my words.
Click to expand...

coju said:
Pyro, eh? He is the reason I was lynched last game…
Click to expand...

I see there is some discussion of last game and game history going on. Yes, coju was lynched last game directly or indirectly because of me. You have to realize that defending someone else typically links you to them and causes suspicion. I wasn't about to jump up and say not to lynch coju last game because he was defending me because I had no idea what his role was. I just knew that babyhell was my leader so I didn't have a reason to jump up and defend him. I think coju was probably just trying to be nice based on our history of playing a lot of D2 together and that got him in trouble. Sorry about that coju.
 
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