Create Your Own Role Mafia game

[Moar]

Everything matters. And I blame you and Goryani for the spam. But it's been a long time without a vote from me :O

Vote: Malevolent

For earlier posts where, to me, it looks like he just wants to ride the heat on me without actually reading what I said.

Please quote and reason more why you vote him. Right now I can't see it. I don't get a really scummy vibe from him. He always writes a bit scummy, but he did that both as scum and not, verified by last game. You look far more scummy to me. You don't want a role claim as it takes too much time. You soften up when you see it was not the best thing to say. You surely spam. What's wrong with multiquoting? I'll be back with a post about your posts.

 

[Sathoris]

i have been reading everything you say sath, and i am not ridfing the heat, im fact i am one creating a lot of it.

kestegs also does seem kind of suspicious gwai, but sath is just digging his grave, also his huge amount of posts makes me nervous too.

Vote: Sathoris

Oh are you? Let's delve into your posts then.

@ sath, why are you so opposed to the idea of next-day claiming? everyone else here that has mentioned it is in favour. It should be helpful for the town, and it may end up wasting a lot of time, but overall it is most likely to be a great info gathering asset.

with every post you seem to push against this concept further!

Since my first post and before your post I've actually mentioned I am in favour of roleclaiming and targetclaiming. Tell me, how am I pushing against next-day claiming further? You didn't properly read my posts or else you would have noticed that like others have.

maybe sath, but i think simply giving every day a sense of purpose is important to make sure that everybody participates fully. If a mafia tries to hide under that radar it will show easily when everyone has to claim for the last day. Think about your last game sath, everyone had to claim thier role and there was no way for the mafia to hide it.

I will draw up a table before the next day starts, i am happy to keep track of the roles.

You even acknowledge my 'ammended' statement and you think I'm 'maybe' right but you will keep track anyway. You knew exactly how I felt earlier, but then why do you later bring out such a ridiculous statement? People commented on my statement and agreed to disagree. Then you resurrect it with a wrong statement and Ankeli jumps aboard.

well ankeli, that pretty much sums up my feelings about sath, however since it is a 72 hour day i am not going to vote just yet, heaps of time left.

ill do a post count right at the very end of the day so that it is possible to track tomorrows posts without counting individual ones, we know who teh spam is today but it could help to keep any mafia spammers at bay for tomorrow

also be-warned sath does have a lot of posts so if kestegs not so subtle hint wasnt true then it could be important to not let sath have the most posts, just in case...

So Ankeli sums up your feelings for me? Sounds like Ankeli 'created' the heat and you are following his thoughts.

You acknowledge my statement, then you suddenly decide to forget it and attack me and when Ankeli sums up your feelings you follow him in voting me. Doesn't look good.

Oh and it's obvious I have the spammer role and I don't intend on getting killed of on N1 again. That's also what the role was made for, no other point to it for a townie. And if you really want to lynch me, I stand no chance against Kestegs in a spam battle..

 

[Sathoris]

Please quote and reason more why you vote him. Right now I can't see it. I don't get a really scummy vibe from him. He always writes a bit scummy, but he did that both as scum and not, verified by last game. You look far more scummy to me. You don't want a role claim as it takes too much time. You soften up when you see it was not the best thing to say. You surely spam. What's wrong with multiquoting? I'll be back with a post about your posts.

As Goryani said last game, single quoting 'forces' the quoted player to respond to my quote. Secondly, post count. Thirdly, Mal case post is up. Fourthly, I've never been against role claiming, just long term role action analysis. Fifthly, I still think it will take a lot of time from our scumhunting, others agree.

 

[Moar]

As Goryani said last game, single quoting 'forces' the quoted player to respond to my quote. Secondly, post count. Thirdly, Mal case post is up. Fourthly, I've never been against role claiming, just long term role action analysis. Fifthly, I still think it will take a lot of time from our scumhunting, others agree.

Lots happened while on my bathroom break and wine seraching quest since I posted. I haven't had time to see more in what Sath wrote but I do have the distinct memory that he was very much against wasting time on claimed roles since it would take half a day of discussion. So you never were against claiming?

 

[Moar]

Yes, let's go through the actions of thirteen complicated roles that all affect each other. I'm not waisting half of our day phase.

This. I think we should spam now.

 

[Moar]

I think Sathoris is scum (see recent posts) but I will not vote for him yet since he pretty much admitted to being the spammer and the postcount at lynch is the one logged. So I will wait to when he is overtaken. His post count is 20 now, followed by kestegs with 16 and flubb with 15. Any of you two can (and want to) challenge him?

 

[thefranklin]

Lots happened while on my bathroom break and wine seraching quest since I posted. I haven't had time to see more in what Sath wrote but I do have the distinct memory that he was very much against wasting time on claimed roles since it would take half a day of discussion. So you never were against claiming?

Remember when you floated the idea waiting 24 hours before claiming? And now you jump out and defend the very first vote on Mal. I got my eye on you. Something else you said earlier seemed scummy on you, I gotta check on that when I am off my phone in a few hours.

 

[Moar]

I had my notes wrong and thought the king had to chose within 24 hours. Absolutely my bad and kestegs pointed it out. Without that I am for an early claim. I don't defend the vote on Mal, just the reason for it. Mal is always scummy and I said that before. But I really don't see any reasoning behind Saths vote and right now Sath is my #1 for scum, please see earlier reasoning).

 

[Gwaihir]

Gory, or maybe sometime else asked me shortly after that post to clarify and I did further explain my thoughts. I'll look it up after I get home from work.

Betting it wasn't Gory, mods tend not to comment on that.
But on a more serious note:

I think claiming what you had the previous day is okay, but you bring up a good point. If it's going to dominate half of the days talk then I would for sure be against it as it's already difficult enough to secure a lynch sometimes.

That was a bit of poor wording in my part in that post.
I think at least some people need to claim every day what they did the previous day, like ones that have active abilities. But while I say that I don't want us to sit on our laurels for half the day waiting for that last person to claim so we have the whole picture. The sooner we start moving towards a lynch in a day the more likely one is to happen.

You did have a second post on it, clarifying the first. But I don't think anyone was recommending stopping discussion until everyone had claimed - that's just silly. And why would discussing roles slow down the ability of the town to get a lynch? To me it seems like you are using weak arguments to push against the idea.

I think Sathoris is scum (see recent posts) but I will not vote for him yet since he pretty much admitted to being the spammer and the postcount at lynch is the one logged. So I will wait to when he is overtaken. His post count is 20 now, followed by kestegs with 16 and flubb with 15. Any of you two can (and want to) challenge him?

Are you honestly proposing trying to out spam the spammer? Do you think this is a good use of our lynch today?

It seems like you are just trying to derail the rest of the day in a spam war.

 

[Moar]

Well, I thought it was possible to get the spammer lynched if we are careful with when to have the most posts. I asked questions and apparently i was wrong. So I don't think a spam war is an option. The spammer can always win.

I want Sathoris lynched, see earlier comments. He has pretty much admitted the spammer so there is not a chance to lynch him unfortunately I think.

 

[flubbucket1]

maybe sath, but i think simply giving every day a sense of purpose is important to make sure that everybody participates fully. If a mafia tries to hide under that radar it will show easily when everyone has to claim for the last day. Think about your last game sath, everyone had to claim thier role and there was no way for the mafia to hide it.

I will draw up a table before the next day starts, i am happy to keep track of the roles.

Okay Malevolent, since you are clearly the man; bringin' the heat, cuttin' the cheese and slammin' da spam up in dis mug......

I'm gonna guess you have a handle on the incredible lurkers as well. :unimpressed:

 

[Kestegs]

I think Sathoris is scum (see recent posts) but I will not vote for him yet since he pretty much admitted to being the spammer and the postcount at lynch is the one logged. So I will wait to when he is overtaken. His post count is 20 now, followed by kestegs with 16 and flubb with 15. Any of you two can (and want to) challenge him?

I will challenge him if I think he is scum by the end of the day. Otherwise I will let him spam it up and your plan will fail.

vote: Sathoris

As you wish.

Betting it wasn't Gory, mods tend not to comment on that.
But on a more serious note:




You did have a second post on it, clarifying the first. But I don't think anyone was recommending stopping discussion until everyone had claimed - that's just silly. And why would discussing roles slow down the ability of the town to get a lynch? To me it seems like you are using weak arguments to push against the idea.



Are you honestly proposing trying to out spam the spammer? Do you think this is a good use of our lynch today?

It seems like you are just trying to derail the rest of the day in a spam war.

Oh, my bad, not sure who I was thinking of there. Yes, that is the post I was referring to. Maybe they weren't recommending that, but that is the way I have seen games go in the past.

Well, I thought it was possible to get the spammer lynched if we are careful with when to have the most posts. I asked questions and apparently i was wrong. So I don't think a spam war is an option. The spammer can always win.

I want Sathoris lynched, see earlier comments. He has pretty much admitted the spammer so there is not a chance to lynch him unfortunately I think.

Yes, that's a good role to get out of the way if you are mafia, let's do it.

Okay Malevolent, since you are clearly the man; bringin' the heat, cuttin' the cheese and slammin' da spam up in dis mug......

I'm gonna guess you have a handle on the incredible lurkers as well. :unimpressed:

For having nothing better to do he is quite the proficient lurker this game. He did pop in the second he was voted on to return an OMGUS vote though, so he's obviously reading the game.

 

[Kestegs]

Sorry, that post looks kinda angry. I'm not mad, I just don't like being forced to vote for a target I don't think is scummy, and one that also is going to be hard to lynch due to the fact that he has claimed spammer. Basically the town is now 1 vote short.

If I had a choice I would go for Mal or Moar right now though. I can't really see the case against sath right now, probably because he said similar things to me and they obviously make sense to me since I said them also.

 

[Moar]

I will challenge him if I think he is scum by the end of the day. Otherwise I will let him spam it up and your plan will fail.

vote: Sathoris

As you wish.



Oh, my bad, not sure who I was thinking of there. Yes, that is the post I was referring to. Maybe they weren't recommending that, but that is the way I have seen games go in the past.



Yes, that's a good role to get out of the way if you are mafia, let's do it.



For having nothing better to do he is quite the proficient lurker this game. He did pop in the second he was voted on to return an OMGUS vote though, so he's obviously reading the game.

Yes, I wished.

I'll go against the whole claiming philosophy right now. Curse me for that or lynch me for that, I don't care. I'm the politician and I made kestegs vote for Sathoris. (I didn't know I could, thought I had to choose either day or night action, but got a friendly reminder).

So why is kestegs reacting like that? For me it shows a try of protecing Sathoris and I don't like it a bit. I'm sure they are buddies and since I think we can't get rid of the spammer I will vote kestegs.

Vote: kestegs

 

[Pyrotechnician1]

Agreed.

I see far more benefit than harm in doing the "claim the previous Day's roles/actions the next Day". Less information for us can only help the Mafia.

I agree with the above statement, any information helpful to isolating a potential lie or mis-step by mafia can only help us more.

See previous post. And wasting is a subjective term. I'm not against people claiming what role they had, not that it matters because mafia can't lie because we know which roles are in the game so we gain no useful information this way. Analyzing the results when mafia will lie about their targets is wasting our time.

I'd rather we discuss who people targeted and why. Effects of the roles are more ambiguous and that is what I'm against analyzing every day.

Piecing together the results of the claims and if they were the actual true events that took place is going to be difficult and time consuming, but it requires mafia to construct a story, and the story has to make sense. As we've all seen before, stories start to fall apart when you get down to details and there are less things to hide behind.

Claim away, however getting everyone to claim their role within the first ~12 hours is usually impossible. People will say to wait untill we've had all the claims before we people tell who they targeted. Mafia will ofcourse lie about what they did, which is easy for about half of the roles. Hence, the subsequent analysis is useless and wastes everyone's time.

And it's not like last game where every ability action can be checked by the stories to verifiy them.

Well, you could always write us up some nice stories so that we would know what happened :crazyeyes:. Mafia lie, thats what they do, but if we don't have anything to analyze then what is happening in this game? Nothing, exactly what they want to happen.

It doesn't, the comment was purely on the side of Mafia. Giving up information that shouldn't. Remember Pryo's (was it?) PM power role in the cheers game and he said he wasn't allowed to give out certain information because it wouldn't be in the spirit of the game? That's how I feel that comment was.

That was the bartender role, and I believe it was pancake, he would be able to listen in on the various night chats, but he couldn't post directly, making it very difficult.

Best post of the thread

Of course its the best, it came from me!

I noticed the exact opposite of you - I don't really see a ton of ways townies die quicker than the normal pace. What makes me nervous is I saw a ton of ways for mafia to keep their players from being lynched and get townies lynched instead.

From the quote, my thought was we lynch the last laugh, get his alignment, and then lynch the next person to get him back if he was townie - basically confirming a townie or mafia. Upon rereading, that doesn't work as we do not get the alignment of the person killed.

And really, spammer scares you the most? It can be pretty easily combated, and is relatively obvious. The one that scares me the most is definitely the kingmaker, and by far the largest reason that I want claims the day after - if we don't, mafia can redirect a lynch anytime they receive the kingmaker (until they have 1 person), as well as any time a townie accidentally gives them the role.

Not sure why everyone is focusing on the spammer role, great, they are immune for one day, doesn't really help them that much if they are essentially proven scum. Each of the roles has an aspect that the mafia can use to their advantage to alter results and cause confusion. Yes, the kingmaker is a danger, but so is the Psychic with that skip the next day phase card, and the politician's roleblock ability.

In my opinion, we should not claim when we still have the roles - would allow mafia to kill off roles they don't like and avoid those that can prevent them from killing. I proposed the following

Get day 1 role
Day 1, day 1 powers used
Lynch
Night 1, night 1 powers used
roles randomized, get day 2 role
Day 2, day 2 powers used and day 1 powers revealed



Might work that we catch a mafia in a lie, which would be a huge bonus. I think it is more likely that we are able to keep mafia more honest than if we didn't have any reveals.

Actually, typing that made me realize I made a mistake. Should have kept my mouth shut today and proposed this tomorrow, making it more likely to catch a mafia in a lie after seeing last night's actions.

Claiming in the same day that someone has the role would be just plain rediculous. I know you aren't suggesting that and your plan is quite the opposite, but if anyone actually considered doing so I would have been shocked.

Okay, I understand where you're coming from. I still disagree, however. Every time we make the mafia claim something, they either have to tell the truth (which works against their win condition usually), or they tell a lie, which increases the chance they get caught. Both are win/win in my book. Therefore, I think we should definitely proceed with the 'next day' claims.



Biggest thing that jumps to mind is the Kingmaker. Namely, the person he named as king the following day. For instance, let's say I'm Kingmaker today. Tonight, I'd choose someone to be King. Tomorrow I have a completely new role, claim that I had Kingmaker yesterday, and possibly divulge who the King is today. Is that helpful to town? Probably. But it does create the possibility that the town tries working in some lynch shenanigans, to which we spend half a day trying to work out some convoluted plan to confirm town and lynch scum at the same time.

I think not knowing who the chosen king is, is much more dangerous than knowing. If we don't know who the king is and the lynch gets switched then we won't know who to focus on the next day phase. I see this as dangerous and works against the only countermeasure we really have to that role.

@ sath, why are you so opposed to the idea of next-day claiming? everyone else here that has mentioned it is in favour. It should be helpful for the town, and it may end up wasting a lot of time, but overall it is most likely to be a great info gathering asset.

with every post you seem to push against this concept further!

- i too am concerned about the kingmaker role, very nasty and it cannot really benefit town. UNLESS, we make sure to claim FAST the next day, so we can hammer the scum who used the kingmaker ability( it will be hard for the scum to hide if we mass-claim i reckon)

- another dangerous role is the paris hilton role, IF it was given the a mafia first then that mafia could choose thier scumbuddy as a BFF, so all future hiltons will be talking with a mafia member, to anybody who has the paris hilton role, please be very careful about who you pick, I for one am not going to trust what i hear from the BFF.

I'm not sure how claiming FAST, is going to help anything with the kingmaker role, although I feel keeping this role in the open is important. I think the chat portion of the BFF role is essentially null. Unless the alignment of the BFF can somehow be confirmed there will always be some element of doubt to anything that is said between the two players.

 

[Pyrotechnician1]

Ankli's case is not strong enough for me place a Vote right now, though there may be some merit to it. I feel far more uneasy about Gwaihir but I would still, as usual, look towards the lurkers in this game. Pyrotechnician has one post to his name, with half of the Day gone by, and not a useful post at that.

Pyrotechnician:

Any opinions on events thus far?
What do you think of the role-claiming-the-next-Day idea that has been put forth?
Any players that you suspect to be Mafia?

Getting through my opinions currently, I'm not trying to be out of sight in this game, but I'm getting slammed at work and probably will be until after the 15th. I love tax season, its the best. Definately pulled a 14 hour day yesterday, and today is turning out the same. I knew I needed to catch up though so here I am. Who my suspects for mafia are so far is iffy, the majority of the day phase has been wasted with deciding how and when were going to claim and if we are going to claim, but at the same time it has produced some interesting conversation so I guess its not really wasted now is it?

I'm sorry sweetheart I wasn't clear. I meant you bare on a rug. I hope that's clearer.....and pics start showing up in my inbox PRONTO!!!



Please don't misinterpret this as me being noble...:rolf:...but IF I had the kingmaker role, and I'm a townie, would it be in the best interest of the town to be lynched in order to get rid of the role and make sure it doesn't wind up in the hands of mafia??

I say this because worse case scenario would be mafia getting the role and continuing to rotate it amongst themselves.

What am I missing thinking this way?

Your missing Mr. Mad scientist role, any role taken out can be easily put back in as long as its been identified somehow.

I have seen Pyro adopting the Noodle principle in the past few games.

Noodle hardly posts, but he hardly posts and they contain absolutely nothing of worth. I try to actually put something of substance in my posts and I think I average a bit more than he does thank you very much. Also, I could have 50,000 posts too if I start doing single post quotes like the rest of you all seemed so concerned about doing. Apparently everyone had the sudden urge to follow in Goryani's posting style, how convienent.

To be honest I wouldn't mind if the kingmaker claimed straight away and we lynched him today just to get the role out of the way. It's a game changing role for either party, but the mafia has so much of an easier time using it efficiently than the town does that it's not even funny. That is, if the current kingmaker feels up to dying this early. Personally, I'll claim it straight off if I get it just to get it out.

Once again, taking a role out does not necessarily mean it will stay out.

I don't think a scum Paris would want a scum BFF since Paris must vote for the BFF at hammertime. Why would scum take that risk?



I don't think it's overpowered if we do the day before roleclaims. How can mafia effectively use the role to save one of their own if the king has to claim? Can't be used before endgame me thinks. Or am I missing something here?



That's pointless. Roles can be resurected this game.

I think the hammertime effect is a balancing effect to make the role more of an equal playing field for mafia or town. Its a risk that they would have to consider.

The BFF thing is interesting.
Town + Town
Town + Mafia
Mafia + Mafia

Town + Town, has the situation where no one can truly trust each other. In which case, maybe confirming the BFF is town can be very helpful.

Town + Mafia, Again, Town won't trust the other member, but I can see mafia making up stuff to try to cloud their judgemnet

and M+M doesn't really add much.

The BFF claiming could let us work on us confirming they are town. From there, the 'Paris'' of the world (lulz) will know if they can trust him/her or not.

...boobbucket....hawt.

Let me know when you find that magic mirror that can confirm the BFF, until the time we are fairly certain of their alignment I don't think I will be taking much merrit in what they have to say.

 

[Malevolent]

well i am not too sure about the kestegs+sath situation, but since kestegs isn't going to spam it up i guess i will have to, sorry about this guys..

 

[Malevolent]

Green Eggs And Ham

By Dr.Seuss

 

[Malevolent]

I am Sam....

 

[Malevolent]

Sam I am....