1.13 Public Test Realm online!

[bcoe]

Re: 1.13 Public Test Realm online!

As I think about the respec issue, I'm coming around somewhat. I think a good compromise might be that the den of evil reward is only available until you leave act 1. That way you can sort of have specialization for each difficulty, but you don't just end up with a single character from each class that gets re-specced each time you want to try something different...

 

[DeathMaster]

Re: 1.13 Public Test Realm online!

I read through and most seems to forget the real problem behind respec.

If it is for the good reason as number of people stated, it should only be limited to once per difficulty. So you can play through normal, change to NM, then finally change again in Hell.

The problem is the ability to unlimited change. How hard is to save handful of tokens? Now all you need to do is to have one high level character for each class. eg. Today, I want play uber zealot, respec my pally. In the afternoon, some mate wants a MP game, he will bring a sorc, respec to conviction. Then I want a smiter, etc ...

I have a lvl98 char from 1.09, with that ability, I can bring to 1.13, suddenly I have "played" almost every possible build for that class provide I can have the gear. Or simply reach the "impossible", like having a stateless, skilless HC sorc to lvl 99 (DC can certainly claim one now).

The boost to CE isn't big deal to character, but I would assume it would also increase the chance your character being killed by Nihlathak's CE. This might be a bigger problem.

The remove of IM - I have mixed feeling. Do I hate the curse? absolutely. Do I want to remove it? I don't feel like. It adds element of danger, which isn't a bad thing. I like the idea IM damage been capped.

What I really like to see, is to reduce the freaking dolls damage.

Edit: I don't play cheesydin, but I think it is still strong build in 1.13, just not as unreasonably overpowered as in 1.10 - 1.12.

Edit 2: the only good thing I can think now for respec, is it makes millions times easier to build a wolfbarb. I always wanted to build one, but it is too annoying for normal attack all the way until you reach lvl79.

 

[Calamityy]

Re: 1.13 Public Test Realm online!

The respec really is getting some hate. Sure it is a bit more common than it should be, but still is very useful.

Yea, it can be abused, just stockpile tokens (Which isn't hard even with key rarity- Say its 1 in 15 each, I get 15 of each Andy/Meph/Diablo/Baal kills (Which for those 60 kills total, should get something nice), along with a respec. So someone who likes to MF bosses will of course have a field day.

But it really does have it's advantages that shouldn't be overlooked. Besides that casters don't have to chug as many blues and can pump energy until in good gear, theres also a lot of mistakes made. We all have those builds sitting in late NM or early Hell (Maybe even Mat'd Pat'd if you didn't have the heart to abandon it), that would be nice to get a second chance. It at least lets you learn "This build just isn't for me", and get your mistakes fixed anyways.

Besides- to anyone who isn't a perfectionist (Ok- I am), a lot of people's goal in the game is to speed through Normal and NM as fast as you can, and maybe even most of Hell. This just streamlines that process for you.

 

[sirpoopsalot]

Re: 1.13 Public Test Realm online!

I think I may have just figured out some of the (possibly flawed) reasoning behind the respec - they didn't implement an extended stash.

For online players, now you don't need a multitude of characters to go with your multitude of mules, and you'd have less characters to 'keep active'. So you keep a zealot/hammer mule, and one paladin character, and swap around gear & stats as you feel fit - this way you'll be pretty active and you don't have to worry as much about your characters expiring.

 

[Sihaknight]

Re: 1.13 Public Test Realm online!

I don't get it - the ability to respec should be of zero importance for SP. If you don't want to use it, then don't. It's not like you could not do this before (with trainers etc).

 

[DeathMaster]

Re: 1.13 Public Test Realm online!

For online players, now you don't need a multitude of characters to go with your multitude of mules, and you'd have less characters to 'keep active'. So you keep a zealot/hammer mule, and one paladin character, and swap around gear & stats as you feel fit - this way you'll be pretty active and you don't have to worry as much about your characters expiring.

Good thinking. I don't play b.net, but it makes sense. I assume you can have two or three "build" in one. Eg. All you need to do is to swap a few items to change a scorc from blizzard, to pure lightning, or dual tree. One char would be enough to replace was used to be three.

 

[Doppel]

Re: 1.13 Public Test Realm online!

I don't get it - the ability to respec should be of zero importance for SP. If you don't want to use it, then don't. It's not like you could not do this before (with trainers etc).

I'm sorry but that logic is simply said retarded, or i know, lets add in a official dupe feature and a "create whatever item you like" feature, and a "make character level 99" feature, as you don't actually have to use them and its not like you could not do this before with trainers, etc,... See? Retarded.

 

[bcoe]

Re: 1.13 Public Test Realm online!

I'm sorry but that logic is simply said retarded, or i know, lets add in a official dupe feature and a "create whatever item you like" feature, and a "make character level 99" feature, as you don't actually have to use them and its not like you could not do this before with trainers, etc,... See? Retarded.

I don't know, I think thats a bit harsh. There are features built into the game that are not allowed in the SPF. The -act5 command comes to mind. I think that if the community as a whole decides to not use some component of the new patch, so be it.

 

[Sihaknight]

Re: 1.13 Public Test Realm online!

I'm sorry but that logic is simply said retarded, or i know, lets add in a official dupe feature and a "create whatever item you like" feature, and a "make character level 99" feature, as you don't actually have to use them and its not like you could not do this before with trainers, etc,... See? Retarded.

Man..really? I mean are you serious?

This is SP right? If that enhances your gaming experience then I think you should do whatever the **** you want. Ok, I shouldn't have mentioned the trainers, but still. See, here's the thing, I try to enjoy myself as much as possible. For me, that's beating the game without cheating or being cheesy. That means no 1.09 ravenclaw, no HF rushing, no RRM. Sure, "the community" thinks it's ok, but I'm not a fan (I'm not saying it's right or wrong). This is a very personal choice and it's different for everyone. I've set these rules for myself, and I don't break them "just because I can". If you are that kind of person that needs some higher authority to use or abuse certain features in a ****ing game, I'd say you have a problem. I mean, some guys only play untwinked single pass HC and that's fine too -because this is SP and you should do want enhances your gaming experience the most.

Applied to the respec part, that means if YOU think it's not right, than it's your personal choice not to do it. In the end, this will be the same as guys who feel the need to do full clears and people who don't. I don't want to de full clears, so I don't. You don't want to respec, that's fine. Don't.

If you want to whine or call people names or whatever, and you play SP, you should focus on the things that you can't control yourself. Like the removal of IM.

Or you could be a real keyboard warrior and say that it's all retarded. Up to you, I guess. Whatever makes you enjoy this great game more.

 

[TurtleBay]

Re: 1.13 Public Test Realm online!

I'm sorry but that logic is simply said retarded, or i know, lets add in a official dupe feature and a "create whatever item you like" feature, and a "make character level 99" feature, as you don't actually have to use them and its not like you could not do this before with trainers, etc,... See? Retarded.

This isn't "retarded" at all, I think that this would make the game more fun. It would still take months to get to level 99 even with unlimited respecs. It would also take a very long time to do boss runs for the grail so both of your comparisons are false analogies. What is most retarded: rushing your characters through normal, using cheap broken items like khalim's flail and bugged ravenclaws, completing most of normal with one skill point in each spell until level 24 or 30, restarting a char because blizzard decided to nerf it, or being allowed occasional respecs. Among that list, I think occasional respecs are the least retarded.

 

[Arkardo]

Re: 1.13 Public Test Realm online!

Say guys, is this beta downloadable as a file? I wonder, as a greedy SP-er, whether we could (ab)use certain features that are removed for 1.13 final. You know, like in 1.10 beta?

 

[wakiki]

Re: 1.13 Public Test Realm online!

I'm not a mod or anything, but I'm getting rather uncomfortable seeing "retarded" being used this frequently here. Can we tone it down? (Yes, I realize some of you are responding to Doppel's use of it, but it's still uncool.)

I agree with the idea about a damage cap on IM. Perhaps it should be 100, since there some attacks that deal damage every 2 frames. (Whirlwind, right?) 1250 damage in a second is plenty, I think. Or they could make it like 5% of damage returned. I would like to see them have a form of Blood Mana that works on all ranged characters, too, not just ones with more mana than health. I actually love the Blood Mana curse and think it's very a well balanced skill. Sure, it slows you down alot, and makes you use health potions, but it makes you think every time you click which is cool imo.

 

[mattinm]

Re: 1.13 Public Test Realm online!

I'm not a mod or anything, but I'm getting rather uncomfortable seeing "retarded" being used this frequently here. Can we tone it down? (Yes, I realize some of you are responding to Doppel's use of it, but it's still uncool.)

^^ +1

I've been mucking about with my characters in 1.13 (I backed them all up and intend to delete all the current saves and revert back to 1.12, unless I fully commit to the patch), and Firewall is absolutely insane now.

I re-spec'd my tal sorc with 20 points in warmth, firewall, and fm, and she utterly owned Meph on /p1 in Hell, with the safety of the moat trick. ~15k damage, compared to ~8.3k pre-patch, is ludicrous. This could become an excellent starting Meph runner, as there's no need to worry about keeping a merc alive for insight and maxed warmth will minimize potion use. Sure, she lags behind a blizz sorc in /p8 games, but with a wand of lower resist (level 2), she still brought Meph down crazy quick.

Then, once you build a steady base of items, you could obviously re-spec into a blizz sorc for more efficiency while opening up the AT and extra fast pindle. I think that's what I'll probably end up doing if I decide to play 1.13 from scratch (likely hardcore). I like the though of building useful skills for normal and nightmare, then worrying about hell later; until I got my 1.06 RC (unavailable on the realms), it was terrible to get some builds through normal and the start of nightmare. Perhaps this will mean people actually play through the game with new characters, instead of just rushing on the realms (yeah, fat chance, but here's to hoping).

Also, why on earth was poison nova enhanced (let alone CE)? My pit-runner gained over 1k damage without the benefit of any GCs; that's just insane. He already owned everything he could break the immunity on!

I'll probably back this files up for my version switcher, that way I can continue to play 1.12a as my main game and swap to 1.13 whenever I feel. I'll throw up a Trenshadow compatible version of the folder if I get permission from the mods.

 

[Rhyme]

Re: 1.13 Public Test Realm online!

Hey... I haven't downloaded 1.13 yet (after staunchly defending it... Wacky, I know), but for the talk of the resolution change, what exactly are we talking about? I heard something about widescreen.

It's worth pointing out that resolution changes have a HUGE effect on coding for a game like this. I remember reading something a while ago about how much of a nightmare it was to up the resolution for LoD, and how we were unlikely to ever see another resolution hike because it required a full redo of monster behavior coding. If that's the case, I would guess THAT would be the reason this patch took so damn long.

Which is not to excuse how long it took. Blizzard takes too long, period, end of story. Work expands to fill the time you give it, and if they would just set a damn deadline, I GUARANTEE they would produce games of 90% of their usual quality in about 1/10 of the time. If you see how quickly they fix some critical bug, it becomes clear that they can do a hell of a lot in a small period of time when their asses are held to the fire.

So, can anybody else give insight into the resolution stuff? Am I right in remembering that a resolution change meant a lot of re-coding back when LoD was released?

 

[TurtleBay]

Re: 1.13 Public Test Realm online!

I'm not a mod or anything, but I'm getting rather uncomfortable seeing "retarded" being used this frequently here. Can we tone it down? (Yes, I realize some of you are responding to Doppel's use of it, but it's still uncool.)

Apologies, I was responding to Doppel and put it in quotes to make sure that that intent was shown. I still shouldn't have said it more than once though...

 

[snickersnack]

Re: 1.13 Public Test Realm online!

I'm not a mod or anything, but I'm getting rather uncomfortable seeing "retarded" being used this frequently here. Can we tone it down? (Yes, I realize some of you are responding to Doppel's use of it, but it's still uncool.)

Me too. Can we also leave out ****? That sort of language, while censored, is not part of the kind of atmosphere I've come to enjoy here.

 

[smips]

Re: 1.13 Public Test Realm online!

Everyone realizes respecs are an option and don't need to be used, right?

Seriously, everyone is making way to big a deal about this if you ask me. If you don't like them, don't use them. Personally, I don't think I'll use them, but it can easily make the lower levels much less boring to play. And by "less boring," I don't mean "easier," which is another thing everyone is complaining about. If you like smacking stuff that can't feasibly kill you with a sharp stick for 10 hours instead of making use of low level skills and later die midswing from IM, then just stick with 1.12a.
Perhaps I'm being a bit narrow minded, but it seems like general consensus here is "It's not SP Ubers, so Blizzard hates us and I hate their ideas and the work they did." :/

 

[mattinm]

Re: 1.13 Public Test Realm online!

Fixed an issue where the game window would minimize when running in windowed mode when it lost focus.

How on earth have I not seen anyone talking about this? When I'm running two characters at once (HF rushing, enchantress, etc), my biggest pet peeve is having to remember which instance is which in my task bar or simply alt-tab'ing until I find the correct one.

Sure, not everyone HF rushes, but I know a bunch of people in here do, and I've done it a couple times, and this feature should be nice for that crowd.

EDIT (squid strike):

So, can anybody else give insight into the resolution stuff? Am I right in remembering that a resolution change meant a lot of re-coding back when LoD was released?

The resolution itself isn't actually changed when you maximize the window (this is a windowed mode only fix). Instead, it allows the window to fill the largest possible 4:3 area and uses a technique called blit stretching to make the textures fill the area. Obviously this degrades image quality, but this is only visible to the user, the game views it as if it were in tiny 800x600.

To see this in action, stretch the window so it looks hideous then take a screenshot. Go look at said screenshot and you'll see that it is in fact 800x600, not the ungoldy monstrosity you were looking at. To each his own when it comes to blit stretching, but I think my stance on the subject is clear .

 

[snickersnack]

Re: 1.13 Public Test Realm online!

Perhaps I'm being a bit narrow minded, but it seems like general consensus here is "It's not SP Ubers, so Blizzard hates us and I hate their ideas and the work they did." :/

You mean (as a group) we're bitter that we got the shaft again, so we're ignoring the things they did that might be good? Yeah, probably.

But, we were ignored. They didn't even add "ladder only" runewords to SP - a change that takes about 5 minutes for someone who knows the data files. I wonder if they simply received no requests related to SP? And.....if they do add things to SP in the final patch, well that's great. Unlikely to happen though.

The changes to rune drop rates are nice. The respec could be a very useful feature for those who use it: someone mentioned that it could be an interesting tournament device. I'm tempted by the ability to restat my meteorb who has far too much dex. But, I see no use for more than 3 restats on one character (unless I'm to have only 7 characters total), so the addition of the new respec items only serves to slightly dilute mfing. Even if I do have characters in 1.13, I'll probably still do any serious mfing in 1.12. The difference is very small, but it's there.

The only real problem that I see is that they left several major bugs untouched. Fend? Vipers? Inferno? Vipers can be overcome with outrageous gear, but they're quite broken for untwinked play, and there are still broken skills that simply do not work as they should. Those should have been fixed. Fixing bugs can be hard, but the fact that they put respec before bug fixes indicates that the patch is not for current players, it's for new players. Which is their prerogative, but we can still be irritated by it.

 

[sirpoopsalot]

Re: 1.13 Public Test Realm online!

Calling someone - or someone's ideas/opinions - retarded is not going to be tolerated here. Neither is bypassing or abusing the word filter. Next time I see it happen, heads will roll.

I trust that's perfectly clear, and we can get back on topic now (it looks like several of you have tried to lead us that direction already - thanks).