Guide: WS K Amazon

Re: Guide: WS K Amazon

Greebo said:
I assume here you're running WSK.

BTW: I cannot believe how many Um's you've dumped into this. I mean you could cube like an Ist out of this. And your merc might keep 75resall under conviction... Sick. Anyway.

Loose the manald. You almost never hit with physical part of your damage. The elemental part always hits, and you have insight. Why would you want to leech? You can drink blue pot sometimes, it's not a crime ;). Since you want to have more space in your backpack, put on resistance ring.
--Greebo
Click to expand...

I am indeed running the WSK and mostly I survive ok and my merc isn't too bad. I do use the decoy a lot which does help, I am just a guy who loves maxed resists lol. About the Um's it seems excessive on this one character, but I stripped all of my items from a number of other characters (which is why my merc has Ums in his armour as it used to be my paladins) which is why she ended up with so many Ums on her. The mosers was a completely huge mistake but I did it before I had much stuff and decided to make use of it now.

I will definately switch out that manald, you're right, its a very good idea.

Note: The countess dropped a fair few Um runes but I am loathe to cube them because I find them so useful. And I have horrid luck finding Scintillating Jewels!



 
Re: Guide: WS K Amazon

Nightfish said:
Anyways, enjoy, maybe it helps, maybe it doesn’t but at least it gibs me +1 post count.
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Bumping is against the rules, yerk! I'll have your head for this!! *Shakes fist*

To be serious (which I'm not to fond of), this is a really nice guide. Amazons are my absolute favorite class, so a mf guide for one is truely appreciated. I will add fishyzon to my list of characters to make.


 
Re: Guide: WS K Amazon

This has been a fun build in general, but I'm afraid that I'm stuck at the hell ancients. I'm using fairly standard equipment for this character (i.e. shako, skullder's, titan's/whinstan's, melody matriarchal bow, razortail, insight for my merc). I usually start by getting the ancients strung out in a line and throwing lightning fury at them repeatedly as they chase me around. After a few minutes, Talic and Korlic are usually gone, and I have to switch to my bow for Madawc (he's always lightning immune). At that point my progress becomes so slow that something inevitably goes wrong for me before Madawc is much below half health.

My Freezing Arrow is at lvl 30 (with the synergy at lvl 20), but it seems ineffective. If I could just stand still and shoot constantly for 5 minutes, that would be tolerable (if boring). However, I have had no success at all tanking Madawc with a decoy or merc. As far as I can tell, he will never fall for a decoy, and my merc never survives more than 10 seconds into the fight. Having to dance back and forth to dodge flying axes slows my rate of fire by at least a factor of 4, and that's if I'm taking risks (the axes have a tendency to hit when it looks like they shouldn't--you need to be well clear of them for a guaranteed miss).

Putting aside the sheer amount of time (and luck) required, I'm also having to drink a ridiculous number of mana potions. I tried dumping lots of potions on the ground one time, but the fight dragged on long enough that they ended up getting garbage collected. My pool is about 400 now; is that about standard for a fishyzon, or should I consider swapping out my IAS gloves for frostburns?

If anyone could offer any suggestions for dealing with the lightning immune Madawc, I would greatly appreciate them.
 
Re: Guide: WS K Amazon

What's your merc gear? For the ancients I'd reroll until none of them are cursed... That is by far the most crippling attribute imo. I would also suggest for questing you not have skullder's ire on (even on MF runs I prefer other armors to it like Tal Rasha's ideally... no resists is no good), but for the ancients I suppose it's acceptable. I'd suggest Vamp Gaze (or rockstopper)/Shaftstop to ensure your merc can tank with FULL REJUV support. Have a full belt of full rejuvs... this is for your merc! Also, if the axes are the problem you could try slow missles.

Ancients weren't too hard for me & I had almost the exact same equipment as you except for a Spirit shield instead of whinstan's & a smoke instead of skullder's.
 
Re: Guide: WS K Amazon

As always, crushing blow should solve ancient related problems. For the non-LIs you're kinda not supposed to use LF, CS will be much, much faster... Normally you should be able to personally tank the ancients no problem so that your merc can wear them down with CB. Well, those LI ancients that survive more than 10 seconds, that is.
 
Re: Guide: WS K Amazon

Dude, put a Kelpie Snare on weapon switch, and hit him with it a few times once you've taken out the other two. It'll freeze him in place while you whittle his life force down.
-noodle
 
Re: Guide: WS K Amazon

Let's see: for the LI ancient: I remember I had minor problems with him whilst I tried killing him with Frozen Arrow, it's a somewhat silly thing to do, or at least unnecessary. That's what Crushing Blow is for. On your merc of course, your AR is horrible.

Guillaume's Face for the head, some other weapon than insight, something with CB and life leech. I find that Hone Sundan with 3 Ams in it works wonders. If you don't want to drink blue pots while throwing LF for the first two ancients, keep the weapon in the cube and swap it for the last one. Shaftstop is a good idea for the armor indeed.

Tank the ancient with jab while your merc chips away. Have some life leech on you, you might not be hitting much, but it will be enough so that you'll get through this fight with ~2 rejuvs. You have 75% block, it will help. At the same time your merc will be hitting Madawc without having to go into hit recovery with 80% CB, if you follow my suggestions with equipment. In the worst case this will take a minute or two. It took me around 90 sec and my Madawc was stone skin.

Hope that helps,
--Greebo
PS. All the ideas are as always attributed to NF, I'm merely repeating them.

EDIT: pwned... should have expected that.
 
Re: Guide: WS K Amazon

Life tap wand would help the merc, that's my way of doing it :)
That should be enough to keep your merc alive long enough to survive you taking down the non LI's with CS, and then kill the last one. I remember struggling a lot with the ancients and what made me do it was leveling up to a higher level, which helped the merc a lot. Didn't think about using life tap then, but it would have made things a lot easier and it has helped me past the ancients many times since.
 
Re: Guide: WS K Amazon

Thanks to everyone for the suggestions. I ended up swapping my skullder's out for a shaftstop, and changed around the rest of my equipment in the middle of the battle. Once Madawc was alone, I had Kelpie Snare on switch, and used jab a few times. Not being able to block really hurt, though, so I changed back to Titan's/Whitstan's, put on Guillaume's, and kept jabbing. I started running out of healing potions around the same time that CB stopped being effective, so I took my bow out, and finished up with freezing arrow.

All in all, I'm rather disappointed with the merc. I tried giving him the shaftstop initially, and used both lifetap and full rejuvs, but to no avail. Even with both Guillaume's and a Hone Sundan, he did very little damage (I don't think he was even hitting the ancients) before using up a full belt's worth of full rejuvs, and dieing. Without blocking, he just couldn't take many hits. Even with full blocking, my zon wasn't much better, though. With much less life, she had to use full rejuvs almost as fast as the merc when I tried having her tank for him (that wasn't very effective anyways, thanks to whirlwind).

Oh well, the important part is that I'm past them now, and can finally work on developing a WSK running strategy.
 
Re: Guide: WS K Amazon

Not trying to be an asshole, but you have miscounted the "total skillpoints" amount. 90 would be the correct number.

Loving the build so far. Just level 20 as of now though.
 
Re: Guide: WS K Amazon

Sounds neat, I want to build it (assuming it's still effective 2 years later.) Question on stats though, how much dex? Remember that in order to pierce, you must hit. I know for cows, piercing is absolutely essential, and I pump dex as high as I can. But for WSK, the packs probably won't be THAT enormous compared to cows. Any dex/vit guidelines?
 
Re: Guide: WS K Amazon

I know my AR is crap and I still obliterate anything just fine. That includes cows. Dex... should be covered. Just enough for 75% block / using items. Rest in vit. There is no good way to get incredible AR here. Maybe demon limb (enchant) and a few charms. I'd suggest just giving it a try, I never felt I needed to pierce more than I did. Seriously, if it's not LI it folds like a pair of 2s facing a royal flush...

As for effectiveness... No changes in the game's balances equals no changes in the builds awesomeness. ;)
 
Re: Guide: WS K Amazon

LF is ITD, so AR doesn't matter there. It does matter for FA, but if you pierce a Gloam the arrow usually won't hit anything else except for maybe the wall.
 
Re: Guide: WS K Amazon

I've been through this LF/AR discussion a bunch of times... it isn't about the LF skill trigger, it's about the pierce for subsequent triggers. Run /p8 Hell Cows with 3000 AR and then 12k AR, you will SEE the difference, because LF will trigger a lot more, because you are getting more pierce success since you can hit more. That said, this isn't Hell Cows, the packs aren't as massive, and it's on /players 1. Because of those reasons, I doubt the extra hit/pierce and subsequent extra LF triggers will make a huge difference. I'd probably rather have the extra life in WSK.

New question -- ever considered a non-melee merc? I'm thinking about the ever-annoying Oblivion Knights whose IM kills mercs dead. Act 2 and Act 5 mercs hit melee, so they'd be dead... rogues are fragile and stay at a distance, but how about act 3 mercs? Their offense is crap, but can they hold up as an IM-resistant tank? Hmm...
 
Re: Guide: WS K Amazon

Swordslash said:
I've been through this LF/AR discussion a bunch of times... it isn't about the LF skill trigger, it's about the pierce for subsequent triggers. Run /p8 Hell Cows with 3000 AR and then 12k AR, you will SEE the difference, because LF will trigger a lot more, because you are getting more pierce success since you can hit more.
Click to expand...
No you won't. LF is ITD, this includes the physical hit. There isn't really anything to discuss.



 
Re: Guide: WS K Amazon

stephan said:
There isn't really anything to discuss.
Click to expand...

Funny, I was gonna say the same in my next post to you, since anyone who has ever seriously run 8-player hell cows with a javazon, and has increased their AR by use of Demon Limb, would know and see the very clear and obvious difference in mass kill power, to the point that with the higher AR, the machine is overwhelmed with LF graphics. But hey, believe anything you want.



 
Re: Guide: WS K Amazon

Words words words on a screen. Or you could actually go try it and see for yourself. The difference is plainly obvious. But why go out of your way to be proven wrong, I guess...
 
Re: Guide: WS K Amazon

And what if I said I don't see the difference, what is that any more than words to you still? I'll stop here.
 
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