Blade Fury Analysis

[onderduiker]

Re: Blade Fury Analysis

ITD is the most important mod pvm i belive, but it is useless in pvp, Btw i got on my Bf sin and she is a beast at hld's. max block, max dr, high 80's or 90s fhr, near 8k dmg. Bs(sentinal) is REALLLY affective vs blizz sorcs, witch give me the most trouble, even with raven/snowclash.(fade used not bos)

Although -% Target Defence and Ignore Target Defence apply to Blade Fury and Shield, they do not apply to Sentinel: if Sentinel is used regularly, + to Attack Rating, +% AR, - Monster Defence Per Hit, - Defence from Inner Sight and -% (Enhanced) Defence from Cloak of Shadows, Battle Cry and Conviction would be preferable.

Enter CoS; at level 28 the -def% caps at -95%, and lasts 35 seconds. Since so few monsters have +def%, -95% will literally give you 95% chance to hit. ( Or something like that.)

Also, I'm not saying that CoS makes AR useless, I would still consider having as much as you can, especially against masses or stone skinned monsters, just mentioning this because Jah seems an awful waste to use when this option is right there, and won't work on these bosses either.

The only monsters with +% Enhanced Defence are Ancients buffed by Madawc's Shout: the Stone Skin modifier doubles a Unique monster's defence before any +% ED is applied, so level 28 Cloak of Shadow's -95% ED will reduce a Stone Skin Unique monster's defence to 5% as well... unless it's a Stone Skin Ancient buffed by Shout, or one of the following boss monsters (to which CS doesn't apply at all):

• Blood Raven
• Griswold
• Andariel
• Radament
• Summoner
• Duriel
• Mephisto
• Izual
• Diablo
• Putrid Defilers
• Nihlathak
• Baal

Unlike Curses, CS does apply to Possessed and immobile units like Gargoyle Traps and Tentacle Beasts (although only its -% ED applies: it won't blind them).

Against targets without +% ED, -95% ED can have the same effect as multiplying total AR by 20 (this is after +% AR is applied, so combining as little as +100% AR with -95% ED can have the same effect as +3,900% AR, or multiplying base AR by 40).

 

[Ghoulz]

Re: Blade Fury Analysis

For a BF build, would maxing venom and Bsentinel be wise? Or maybe 10 points or so into death sentry.

And would it be better to use trap gcs, or dmg charms?

I got another question. Is the halo(the part of the skill that keeps people and monsters in a stunlock after the stun duration expires) duration from mind blast fixed or does it increase in level? I was thinking that maybe using trangs gloves and spirit shield would give mind blast a good casting rate for use against stronger monsters that would overwhelm your merc.

 

[Kordova]

Re: Blade Fury Analysis

so any light on if throwing weapons use thrown or one handed dmg.

 

[DDadams]

Re: Blade Fury Analysis

I joined this forum just to post here because NOW I'm intrigued.

I have a spare set of 37x3/12+/12+life sc's on useast scnl.

I was wondering if those charms would affect blade fury and the differences in pvp damage from 37x of those + torch/anni with maxed venom/blade fury/claw mastery (Using eth fury suwayyah and fort)

VS

9xshadow charms/10x3/xx/xx's with torch/anni and same gear


PVP wise of course.

Which would cause more damage?

 

[deathwinger]

Re: Blade Fury Analysis

Someone pointed me towards this thread from d2jsp. I'm not sure if u guys allow to link to guides from there or not, but I wrote a guid efor ummm exactly this kinda sin, before u made this post by a bit. I don't care about pvm at all so its all pvp focused, using really high dmg blade fury & blade sentinel, for both regular dueling and as a TG char (using lbade sentinels).

my gear was ummm:
eth chaos suwayyah (does a little more overall dmg than eth fury im pretty sure, at least with blade fury)
enigma/fortitude switch
phoenix monarcch
rare circlet with fcr / sockets with +80% ed and/or guillaimes (cham'd)
angelics set, or ravens/highlords
trangs/arachs
gore riders

inventorywise, trap gcs add WAY more than those +3 max scs.
think of it this way. each +1 damage added in the skill is equivalent to 1.33 weapon damage on blade fury, or 2.66 weapon damage on blade sentinel. And thats really all there is to figuring out ur overall damage, just multiply ur +skill dmg and add it together like it was +min/max, then divide the total result by the penalty

so um, trap skillers adds +8 blade fury, +5 blade sentinel. Thats like 10.4 damage blade fury, +13.3 blade sentinel. Except that those +3 maxers only add 1.5 avg damage each. So its:

10.4 // 13.3 damage
vs
4.5 // 4.5 damage

so um trap skillers add WAY more dmg, and are cheaper.

 

[deathwinger]

Re: Blade Fury Analysis

and um for eth fury suwayyah vs eth chaos suwayah, look at this:

with the gear i list, u get umm +1100% or so %ed, so 12x the damage modifier. With 158/223 fury/sentinel base damage, my total damages end up as:

Eth Suwayyah:
Fury: 5871 physical + 353 magic + 666 venom, 46% chance for 2x crit = 9591
Sent: 3494 physical + 177 magic + 333 venom, 46% chance for 2x crit = 5311

Eth Fury:
Fury: 4953 physical + 666 venom, 74% chance for 2x crit = 9284
Sent: 3034 physical + 333 venom, 74% chance for 2x crit = 5613


so um.... slightly worse fury dmg an slightly higher sent dmg from fury. BUT if u throw on highlords, the deadly strike wont stack so hot, so chaos would do way better. but um, i like magic damage lols, cuz it does 2x in pvp if they had 50% dr

 

[Ceramic Weasel]

Re: Blade Fury Analysis

Would might or blessed aim from merc be better for BF?

AFAIK, Might is the only merc aura that'll advance beyond lvl 20 or so. It adds a considerable amount of off-weapon +ed% that is extremely difficult to replace. On the other hand, there are a several options available to solve the AR issue besides a BA merc.

Edit: Though a BA merc wielding Pride will accomplish the same thing

For a BF build, would maxing venom and Bsentinel be wise? Or maybe 10 points or so into death sentry.

And would it be better to use trap gcs, or dmg charms?

I got another question. Is the halo ... duration from mind blast fixed or does it increase in level?

Venom is at 3/4 damage on BF, and on successive hits on the same target it'll get re-applied every 6 frames. So, with the exception of the last hit, it's reduced to about 45% of it's listed skill damage. Blade Sentinel does okay in certain situations, I gave my summary of it's damage and potential usefulness in an earlier post, but Death Sentry is by far my favourite of the three.

+3 max dmg scs are applied to the weapon half of the equation, so suffer the 3/4 penalty. As deathwinger says, it's an easy enough comparison:

1x Trap GC = +8 average base damage
3x +3max SCs = +3.375 average base damage

The duration of Mind Blast stun goes up with levels (why ghosts max it), but so does it's chance to convert, which can be a bit annoying when you're trying to kill things.

so any light on if throwing weapons use thrown or one handed dmg.

I just tested this. Strangely, BF uses the thrown damage of throwing weapons.

...using really high dmg blade fury & blade sentinel, for both regular dueling and as a TG char (using lbade sentinels).

my gear was...

Town guarding is something that mentally challenged 10 year olds do because they lack the skill required to win a duel any other way. So I'll just pretend you didn't say that.

With your listed setup, wearing 2x Angelic rings, your AR will be:
BF ~= 2.6k
BS ~= 10k (depending on CM lvl)
Edit: +700 or so BS AR from inherent skill bonus

If your circlet has a visionary mod those numbers increase to around 5k and 13.3k* respectively. 2.6k AR will rarely hit any character unless they're naked or running, and since BF and BS don't seek their targets, it seems as though this build is limited to only hitting people dumb enough to run into the Blade Sentinels.

*Edit: Added +5 BS AR per lvl

I maintain my doubts about the effectiveness of BF (and BS to a lesser extent) in GM duels, but I'm more than happy to have someone demonstrate it in game.

I think the magic damage from Chaos does 258/129 damage with BF/BS, but yes, Chaos will generally do more unless you make Fury in a +3 BF/BS eth Suwayyah. DR, of course, would change that.

 

[onderduiker]

Re: Blade Fury Analysis

Someone pointed me towards this thread from d2jsp. I'm not sure if u guys allow to link to guides from there or not, but I wrote a guid efor ummm exactly this kinda sin, before u made this post by a bit.

I found 'The Fisherwoman Guide: An Bladesin Build' in the Strategy and Guides sub-forum of d2jsp's Discussion and Guides forum, posted on 1 July 2009: Ceramic Weasel posted this thread on 13 July 2009, and both of you appear to have been inspired by the recent update to the Arreat Summit on 15 June 2009.

They say two weeks is a long time in politics...


Incidentally, deathwinger, thanks for linking to the Amazon Basin Wiki's Traps page in your d2jsp guide... a courtesy not extended in inkanddagger's Melee Range: A Picture Guide V2.0, which lifted both images and text from that Wiki's Melee range and Knockback pages without acknowledgement. :unimpressed:

 

[DDadams]

Re: Blade Fury Analysis

Would the AR difference be worth the damage from 37x3/xx/xx's to 9xtrap GC's with 10x 3/xx/xx's?

I'm torn on what to do..

 

[theBanger]

Re: Blade Fury Analysis

Would the AR difference be worth the damage from 37x3/xx/xx's to 9xtrap GC's with 10x 3/xx/xx's?

I'm torn on what to do..

Depends on your objectives.

If your searching to take down hammers, sorcs, and zons, then in these cases more AR would be optimal. However, if your looking to take out windies or necs, then I think the added damage from traps is more effective. I would keep a few good AR charms in the stash for sure, you know the ones with 130 something attack rate.

Just some numbers because I'm a dork with nothing better to do (your welcome):

Eth Suwayyah reqs. 89 dex - 430 AR (89*5 - 15 I think)
Single or duel Angelics at level 90 - 1330 AR single (250 ravenfrost), 2160 AR dual
Say 5 small charms with 3/20/x (you may want 5 for res, or FHR, or something) - 100 AR
Visionary Mod on circ - 90% AR
Fury claw (I think from gul rune) - 20%
Would give............ 3906 AR single ring, and........ 5649 AR duel ring.​

Remember that your CoS will minus some defense, as will Fury, but I won't facter that in b/c it will take forever and I have to eat soon.

With 5 AR grand charms:

Eth Suwayyah reqs. 89 dex - 430 AR
Single or duel Angelics at level 90 - 1330 AR single, 2160 AR dual
Say 5 SCs with 3/20/x 5 GCs with 130 - 750 AR
Visionary Mod on circ - 90% AR
Fury claw (I think from gul rune) - 20%
Would give............ 5271 AR single ring, and........ 7014 AR duel ring.​

Of course these numbers can go on and on changing gear and stats around. I still stand by my original statement that you will be raped by smiters and barbs, AR is just one of the many issues in those cases.

 

[Ceramic Weasel]

Re: Blade Fury Analysis

They say two weeks is a long time in politics...

Curse my obsessive pedanticism and weeks of redundant testing!

Having read deathwinger's guide though, I have to say that it's a very different kind of assassin to the one I had in mind. Not that this is any kind of guide for a particular build. I'll leave those for other people to write.

 

[deathwinger]

Re: Blade Fury Analysis

I found 'The Fisherwoman Guide: An Bladesin Build' in the Strategy and Guides sub-forum of d2jsp's Discussion and Guides forum, posted on 1 July 2009: Ceramic Weasel posted this thread on 13 July 2009, and both of you appear to have been inspired by the recent update to the Arreat Summit on 15 June 2009.

Ter be more precise, I knew the person who wrote that update, and helped him with it.

But yes inkndagger could use a few lessons

 

[Ghoulz]

Re: Blade Fury Analysis

Well im sold on Fury. I don't even have an eth one yet and im already killing alot of things in hell with a single blade.

 

[onderduiker]

Re: Blade Fury Analysis

Ter be more precise, I knew the person who wrote that update, and helped him with it.

These are all the verifiable sources of this Blade skills information of which I'm aware:

DATE POSTED        POSTER           THREAD/TOPIC/PAGE                   LOCATION
_____________________________________________________________________________________________________________
13 July     2009   Ceramic Weasel   Blade Fury Analysis                 diii.net's Assassin forum
 1 July     2009   deathwinger      The Fisherwoman Guide               d2jsp's Strategy and Guides sub-forum
15 June     2009   Nebu             Traps                               Arreat Summit
10 February 2009   Tellemena        The Blademaster                     Amazon Basin's Assassin Room
27 July     2008   onderduiker      Traps                               Amazon Basin Wiki
17 July     2008   TitanSeal        Blade Fury Sin                      Amazon Basin's Assassin Room
27 May      2008   onderduiker      Is Blade Shield a 1 point wonder?   Amazon Basin's Assassin Room

That's not to say there aren't other possible sources, particularly on other sites and in other languages (I believe TitanSeal is German, or at least German-speaking).

 

[deathwinger]

Re: Blade Fury Analysis

you'd have to ask GFraizer directly, then

 

[bluewiind]

Re: Blade Fury Analysis

Very interesting thread...tnx CW. The Vlld sounds intriguing. What would be a good weapon for lev 9 to lets say 15 for BF?

 

[Sass]

Re: Blade Fury Analysis

You cant Vlld...it's a lvl 18 skill...

 

[bluewiind]

Re: Blade Fury Analysis

lol, details, details, so humor me. Lets substitude Lld lev 18-21, what weapon comes to mind?

 

[crawlingdeadman1]

Re: Blade Fury Analysis

a new thread.

 

[bluewiind]

Re: Blade Fury Analysis

Sigh, I hate when no one wants to play, I thought since this is the best current BF thread around and Lld was mentioned before this would be a good place to discuss this. I guess I was mistaken Sorry Crawlingdeadman.