Re: Blade Fury Analysis
eh, i'll contribute to an lld thread, but it's kinda going into another area for this thread...
eh, i'll contribute to an lld thread, but it's kinda going into another area for this thread...
Blade Fury Analysis
- Thread starter Ceramic Weasel
- Start date
Re: Blade Fury Analysis
blade sentinel, doofus
you can hit upwards of 160 blade sentinel damage @ level 9, 200 @ level 12.
Combined with large amounts of FRW & psychic hammer, this compares quite favorably to a sin who deals like 200 average damage TS 3/4 of the time, and 800 average damage TS 1/4 of the time, at melee range
blade sentinel, doofus
you can hit upwards of 160 blade sentinel damage @ level 9, 200 @ level 12.
Combined with large amounts of FRW & psychic hammer, this compares quite favorably to a sin who deals like 200 average damage TS 3/4 of the time, and 800 average damage TS 1/4 of the time, at melee range
Re: Blade Fury Analysis
Thats more like it. I never had a low lev dueler but I am familiar with the general gear, socketed everything with +dam jewels, some of the low lev uniques and set items but I am wondering what a good wep might be for a BF build. Cleglaw's Tooth, The Gnasher Hand Axe come to mind but I am sure there are others.....
Thats more like it. I never had a low lev dueler but I am familiar with the general gear, socketed everything with +dam jewels, some of the low lev uniques and set items but I am wondering what a good wep might be for a BF build. Cleglaw's Tooth, The Gnasher Hand Axe come to mind but I am sure there are others.....
Re: Blade Fury Analysis
-.-
have you not read this thread? the damage is greatly boosted by your stats & claw mastery, which you only get using a claw. There is a thread where I weighed the best possible level 9 bladesin gear, but it was extremely hazy which set of jewels produced the best results. It ends up as a mix of +% ed and +damage jewels, depending on what you can afford.
specifically, this testing:
So a cheap bladesin build might look like this:
ethereal claws with 3x damage jewels in them
gothic plate with 4x 20% ed, possibly -15% reqs jewels
biggins bonnet with a 20% ed jewel
sigons shield with a +max jewel
bloodfists
deaths belt OR lenymo (lenymo very nice for running duels)
rare amulet
2x nagelrings
-.-
have you not read this thread? the damage is greatly boosted by your stats & claw mastery, which you only get using a claw. There is a thread where I weighed the best possible level 9 bladesin gear, but it was extremely hazy which set of jewels produced the best results. It ends up as a mix of +% ed and +damage jewels, depending on what you can afford.
specifically, this testing:
So a cheap bladesin build might look like this:
ethereal claws with 3x damage jewels in them
gothic plate with 4x 20% ed, possibly -15% reqs jewels
biggins bonnet with a 20% ed jewel
sigons shield with a +max jewel
bloodfists
deaths belt OR lenymo (lenymo very nice for running duels)
rare amulet
2x nagelrings
Re: Blade Fury Analysis
"200 @ level 12"
As opposed to a +Max Dam charger who deals
"1500 @ level 12"
Oh, and for lowish level gear (Ignoring jewels for now), I'd recommend Hellplague (Sword - Gives ALOT of Fire damage)
It might not work with Claw Mastery (Do that later), but the Fire Damage is epic for Blade Fury
"200 @ level 12"
As opposed to a +Max Dam charger who deals
"1500 @ level 12"
Oh, and for lowish level gear (Ignoring jewels for now), I'd recommend Hellplague (Sword - Gives ALOT of Fire damage)
It might not work with Claw Mastery (Do that later), but the Fire Damage is epic for Blade Fury
Re: Blade Fury Analysis
a charger would be not even remotely close to VLLD
by LLD101 rules, trapsins are allowed to go up to level 12. However, these rules were written with no comprehension of how blade sentinel works, and thus are hilariously broken. This is why I'd recommend a level 9 bladesin; its mostly as effective, but you won't get people complaining you're level 12.
A level 12 charger, on the other hand, would never be able to duel level 9's.
And hellplague is probably the worst idea I've heard in a while. You are aware that bonesnap exists, right? Its quite possible to get a mediocre damage blade sentinel/fury using ethereal upgraded bonesnap, which is easy enough to acquire. Its not as good as high end claws / etc at level 30, but it suffices.
a charger would be not even remotely close to VLLD
by LLD101 rules, trapsins are allowed to go up to level 12. However, these rules were written with no comprehension of how blade sentinel works, and thus are hilariously broken. This is why I'd recommend a level 9 bladesin; its mostly as effective, but you won't get people complaining you're level 12.
A level 12 charger, on the other hand, would never be able to duel level 9's.
And hellplague is probably the worst idea I've heard in a while
. You are aware that bonesnap exists, right? Its quite possible to get a mediocre damage blade sentinel/fury using ethereal upgraded bonesnap, which is easy enough to acquire. Its not as good as high end claws / etc at level 30, but it suffices. Re: Blade Fury Analysis
"A level 12 charger, on the other hand, would never be able to duel level 9's."
A level 12 charger almost 1-hit my Lvl 32 Paladin (Who later got TPPK'd - But that's irrelevant)
Lvl 1 -> 11 For might + Req's, 12 for charge, piles of Damage Charms and jewels, and those lvl 12 paladins hurt :<
You get piles of the fast little buggers on US-West Hardcore Ladder - Come take a look
"A level 12 charger, on the other hand, would never be able to duel level 9's."
A level 12 charger almost 1-hit my Lvl 32 Paladin (Who later got TPPK'd - But that's irrelevant)
Lvl 1 -> 11 For might + Req's, 12 for charge, piles of Damage Charms and jewels, and those lvl 12 paladins hurt :<
You get piles of the fast little buggers on US-West Hardcore Ladder - Come take a look
Re: Blade Fury Analysis
I'm not sure if you understand. A level 12 charger is Not VLLD
VLLD is level 9 for almost every class, but a few are allowed to go to level 12, due to being underpowered @ 9- feral & maul druids are an excellent example. However, nobody, anywhere regards a level 12 paladin using charge as VLLD. They fall into the exact same bracket as level 18 paladins, and there is no reason to stop at level 12 and not go up to 18.
The old VLLD101 rules state trappers as being able to go up to level 12, but with regards to the overpoweredness of bladesins, level 9 is plenty.
I'm not sure if you understand. A level 12 charger is Not VLLD
VLLD is level 9 for almost every class, but a few are allowed to go to level 12, due to being underpowered @ 9- feral & maul druids are an excellent example. However, nobody, anywhere regards a level 12 paladin using charge as VLLD. They fall into the exact same bracket as level 18 paladins, and there is no reason to stop at level 12 and not go up to 18.
The old VLLD101 rules state trappers as being able to go up to level 12, but with regards to the overpoweredness of bladesins, level 9 is plenty.
Re: Blade Fury Analysis
Elemental damage is fairly mediocre on BF, due to it being at 3/4 effectiveness (or 3/8 with 2H). Though, I suppose if you're stuck using a lvl 1 BF, Claw Mastery won't do you much good.
Please try to keep this on topic, guys. I don't know how deathwinger managed to get banned, but heeding the warnings of moderators is probably a good idea.
BF is a level 18 skill, so no good for VLLD.Oh, and for lowish level gear (Ignoring jewels for now), I'd recommend Hellplague (Sword - Gives ALOT of Fire damage)
It might not work with Claw Mastery (Do that later), but the Fire Damage is epic for Blade Fury
Elemental damage is fairly mediocre on BF, due to it being at 3/4 effectiveness (or 3/8 with 2H). Though, I suppose if you're stuck using a lvl 1 BF, Claw Mastery won't do you much good.
Please try to keep this on topic, guys. I don't know how deathwinger managed to get banned, but heeding the warnings of moderators is probably a good idea.
Re: Blade Fury Analysis
Blade sentinel is a VLLD compatible skill, and is quite viable, and will win pretty much any duel that allows running/etc.
Blade sentinel is a VLLD compatible skill, and is quite viable, and will win pretty much any duel that allows running/etc.
Re: Blade Fury Analysis
It's a shame that this is a thread about Blade Fury, then.
Re: Blade Fury Analysis
Blade fury & sentinel interact the same way with %ed, which is the point of the thread, is it not?
Blade fury & sentinel interact the same way with %ed, which is the point of the thread, is it not?
Re: Blade Fury Analysis
no mr. banned, the point of this thread is to fully understand how dmg is applied by a very complex skill, or to tickle ceramics ego...either way sentinel is a totally different skill
no mr. banned, the point of this thread is to fully understand how dmg is applied by a very complex skill, or to tickle ceramics ego...either way sentinel is a totally different skill
Re: Blade Fury Analysis
I think CDM was just pointing out the off-topic nature of VLLD Bladesins, since that's a topic entirely about Blade Sentinel.
Definitely the second one. :smug:
I think CDM was just pointing out the off-topic nature of VLLD Bladesins, since that's a topic entirely about Blade Sentinel.
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Re: Blade Fury Analysis
I am thinking of a glass cannon famine BF sin. I presume if I use a legendary mallet, I get 1.1% boost pre point in strength, what do you guys think?
I am thinking of a glass cannon famine BF sin. I presume if I use a legendary mallet, I get 1.1% boost pre point in strength, what do you guys think?
Re: Blade Fury Analysis
If you use claws instead of a legendary mallet, you can pump dex instead of str. The benefit of this would be the AR bonus you would receive for from dex, (5AR for 1dex) and that you could use claw mastery to boost your damage further. Although you will only receive 75% of your points as damage, the AR and CM out weigh the benefit of an extra few % from strength alone. As this thread shows, damage from BF itself, is more powerful than from your weapon alone.
If you use claws instead of a legendary mallet, you can pump dex instead of str. The benefit of this would be the AR bonus you would receive for from dex, (5AR for 1dex) and that you could use claw mastery to boost your damage further. Although you will only receive 75% of your points as damage, the AR and CM out weigh the benefit of an extra few % from strength alone. As this thread shows, damage from BF itself, is more powerful than from your weapon alone.
Re: Blade Fury Analysis
I guess, and I might even hope to achieve max block on a monarch, even though that probably won't save me at all. But Famine has virtually no immunity problems with infinity merc.
Re: Blade Fury Analysis
Famine is actually a fairly decent weapon, but as theBanger points out, it doesn't make the best use of the skill damage. It does, however, have much higher weapon damage. If I take the numbers I gave in that final example, subbed the Fury out for a perfect (185%ed), ethereal Legend Mallet Famine, and boosted Str up to 190, I get the following:
Stats Bonus = 2.09
Elemental = 590.5 avg
Lvl 37 Blade Fury = 238 avg
Mercenary skill ed% = +300%
Off-weapon item %ed = +500%
Chance of double damage = 32+15+15 = 62%
Weapon Half = ((402 * (1 + 2.09 + (300+500) / 100) * 1.62) + 590.5) * 0.75 ~= 5,859
Blade Fury Half = 238 * (1 + 2.09 + (300+500) / 100) * 1.62 ~= 4,275
Average Damage per shuriken = 10,134
It's pretty close. Requires more strength, but no investment in Claw Mastery. But there are a few factors to consider:-
1) Perfect ethereal Legend Mallet Famine's are much harder to come by
2) Fury is by no means the highest damaging claw around. A good rare is probably a better choice.
3) The mercenary information in this thread is incorrect. I was using the 1.10 Mercenary Guide provided at this site, but it's either outdated or just plain wrong. The maximum level aura a Might Mercenary can have is 20, before +skills. This means that there's more incentive for the Blessed Aim + Pride mercenary combination, which favours physical damage over elemental.
Famine is actually a fairly decent weapon, but as theBanger points out, it doesn't make the best use of the skill damage. It does, however, have much higher weapon damage. If I take the numbers I gave in that final example, subbed the Fury out for a perfect (185%ed), ethereal Legend Mallet Famine, and boosted Str up to 190, I get the following:
Stats Bonus = 2.09
Elemental = 590.5 avg
Lvl 37 Blade Fury = 238 avg
Mercenary skill ed% = +300%
Off-weapon item %ed = +500%
Chance of double damage = 32+15+15 = 62%
Weapon Half = ((402 * (1 + 2.09 + (300+500) / 100) * 1.62) + 590.5) * 0.75 ~= 5,859
Blade Fury Half = 238 * (1 + 2.09 + (300+500) / 100) * 1.62 ~= 4,275
Average Damage per shuriken = 10,134
It's pretty close. Requires more strength, but no investment in Claw Mastery. But there are a few factors to consider:-
1) Perfect ethereal Legend Mallet Famine's are much harder to come by
2) Fury is by no means the highest damaging claw around. A good rare is probably a better choice.
3) The mercenary information in this thread is incorrect. I was using the 1.10 Mercenary Guide provided at this site, but it's either outdated or just plain wrong. The maximum level aura a Might Mercenary can have is 20, before +skills. This means that there's more incentive for the Blessed Aim + Pride mercenary combination, which favours physical damage over elemental.
- Aug 17, 2003
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Re: Blade Fury Analysis
After taking a brief look at this excellent thread, I decided to continue with my PvM BF assassin. For me, the essence seems to be that the BF bonus is subject to off-weapon %ed, so I have to revise my plans on the gear a bit (in particular after discovering that I followed the recommendations of a guide which was written before we had the second bunch of 1.10 runewords).
Keep in mind that this is for a PvM character and that I'm a bit stingy, so no godly assassin claws or 6 HR runewords like LW. That also means that +life/vit aren't as important as in PvP. I prefer maxed resists. Also, I haven't read all of the thread, so a few questions are probably answered already. Anyway, a summary would be really useful, as this thread is a bit long.
Weapon: Eth Stormlash+Jah... or better a Death ettin axe ? I won't pay 6 HRs for LW or buy a godly claw, I'm too stingy for that. BTW, the eth Stormlash is self-found, that's why I started that furysin after all, so I'm not really willing to exchange it. However, I might consider using Death until she meets the level req of Stormlash, but I would feel a bit silly to switch to Stormlash and then discover that it's worse than Death.
Shield: As off-weapon %ed pays off very well, Tiamat's with a %ed jewel might not be the optimum choice. Better Moser's with two of them ? Headhunter's with three ? Phoenix' ctc druid's firestorm is said to interrupt BF too often, else it would be the ultimate furysin shield, and a 160% monarch seems to lack too much in other respects.
Armor: Fortitude seems to be a must here.
Helm: Guillaume's seems to be the best chioce.
Gloves: LoH will add lots of damage to demons, but crafted knockback gloves might be a good idea as well and you don't need the expensive ones with +skills and IAS.
Belt: I'm rather sure that T-God's complete protection from lightning is better in PvM than e.g. Verdungo's.
Boots: I don't see any reasonable alternative to Gores.
Amu: Probably Highlord's, but Metalgrid add lots of ar which might be helpful versus bosses.
Rings: Ravenfrost isn't really necessary, as BF speed is fixed, but it might be helpful to be able to run away quickly and the ar and dex bonus is definitely very useful. Other ring: Dual leech + ar + resists ?
Charms: Will trap skillers pay off well enough or should it be +max charms ? +lightning dmg SCs ? A torch is mandatory and maybe Anni as well.
Merc: nm act 2 offensive (might), but which weapon ? I'm not sure if he will survive with Pride (not enough on-weapon damage). Infinity would only be useful versus bosses (the aura reduces defense rating of enemies). Insight, so I won't need mana leech ? Or simply Obedience for damage + CB ? Armor/Helm: Whatever makes him survive, no help needed.
After taking a brief look at this excellent thread, I decided to continue with my PvM BF assassin. For me, the essence seems to be that the BF bonus is subject to off-weapon %ed, so I have to revise my plans on the gear a bit (in particular after discovering that I followed the recommendations of a guide which was written before we had the second bunch of 1.10 runewords
).Keep in mind that this is for a PvM character and that I'm a bit stingy, so no godly assassin claws or 6 HR runewords like LW. That also means that +life/vit aren't as important as in PvP. I prefer maxed resists. Also, I haven't read all of the thread, so a few questions are probably answered already. Anyway, a summary would be really useful, as this thread is a bit long.
Weapon: Eth Stormlash+Jah... or better a Death ettin axe ? I won't pay 6 HRs for LW or buy a godly claw, I'm too stingy for that. BTW, the eth Stormlash is self-found, that's why I started that furysin after all, so I'm not really willing to exchange it. However, I might consider using Death until she meets the level req of Stormlash, but I would feel a bit silly to switch to Stormlash and then discover that it's worse than Death.
Shield: As off-weapon %ed pays off very well, Tiamat's with a %ed jewel might not be the optimum choice. Better Moser's with two of them ? Headhunter's with three ? Phoenix' ctc druid's firestorm is said to interrupt BF too often, else it would be the ultimate furysin shield, and a 160% monarch seems to lack too much in other respects.
Armor: Fortitude seems to be a must here.
Helm: Guillaume's seems to be the best chioce.
Gloves: LoH will add lots of damage to demons, but crafted knockback gloves might be a good idea as well and you don't need the expensive ones with +skills and IAS.
Belt: I'm rather sure that T-God's complete protection from lightning is better in PvM than e.g. Verdungo's.
Boots: I don't see any reasonable alternative to Gores.
Amu: Probably Highlord's, but Metalgrid add lots of ar which might be helpful versus bosses.
Rings: Ravenfrost isn't really necessary, as BF speed is fixed, but it might be helpful to be able to run away quickly and the ar and dex bonus is definitely very useful. Other ring: Dual leech + ar + resists ?
Charms: Will trap skillers pay off well enough or should it be +max charms ? +lightning dmg SCs ? A torch is mandatory and maybe Anni as well.
Merc: nm act 2 offensive (might), but which weapon ? I'm not sure if he will survive with Pride (not enough on-weapon damage). Infinity would only be useful versus bosses (the aura reduces defense rating of enemies). Insight, so I won't need mana leech ? Or simply Obedience for damage + CB ? Armor/Helm: Whatever makes him survive, no help needed.
Re: Blade Fury Analysis
Trappers are better since you gain max and min damage,past level 16 it goes to +8min+8max per level in BF.This made me look to see what the damage expotential carries onto but it looks it stops at 8 to 8 damage per level.
Trappers are better since you gain max and min damage,past level 16 it goes to +8min+8max per level in BF.This made me look to see what the damage expotential carries onto but it looks it stops at 8 to 8 damage per level.
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