OT: Nethack

Re: OT: Nethack

I have reached the Plane of Water. The spoiler didn't have much detail, what do I do in this level to move around? I have an amulet of magical breathing so should I put it on?

Nerigazh said:
Grats on getting to the endgame, azn! This is your first time, I take it?

Yes, first time getting this far. I've gotten the Amulet before but I think the Wizard has always killed me before I reached the planes. This forum thread has been crucial!
 
Re: OT: Nethack

I have reached the Plane of Water. The spoiler didn't have much detail, what do I do in this level to move around? I have an amulet of magical breathing so should I put it on?

It´s a good idea to levitate, because then you won´t be forced to stay in an air bubble. Try to move in the general direction to the right of screen.

Magical breathing would work, but levitating is better (goods won´t risk being damaged by water).

If you have protection from (or have genocided) drowning monsters, there is no rush on this level. At this point, the water elementals and minor critters should not be able to hit you for more HPs than you regenerate. Right?

If you have detected the portal (read scroll of gold detection while confused, or used crystal ball and searched for ^) you will see it when you and the portal are in the same air bubble (unless there is an item on that square).



 
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Re: OT: Nethack

3133048 phylogeny-Val-Dwa-Fem-Law ascended to demigoddess-hood 160 [197]

After reading jiansonz's tip about the Plane of Water I used a blessed magic marker on a regular scroll to genocide ";". This led to a very easy trip to the Astral Plane.

On entering the Plane I blinded myself and found Death was in the middle, Famine was on the right, and Pestilence was on the left. I saw a bunch of priests and tried to wrest the last charge out of my dead wand of wishing to get a blessed chickatrice corpse, wasting several turns in the process. I didn't realize that the monsters there were already awake. Pestilence actually came in from the left and started attacking. After killing him, I obviously decided to go to the left since I was already fighting that Horseman anyway.

As I pushed forward, I did not want to generate conflict at first, fearing hostile angels. But as the bad guys became more and more numerous, I decided my guardian angel was worthless and the benefits of conflict would outweigh the downside. The gods sent down a bunch of hostile angels, but it was OK since they were attacking each other as well as other monsters. Midway to the left altar, Pestilence gave his best effort at stopping my ascension when he attacked me as I was surrounded by priests. Got down to 6 HP! Prayed and I was OK again.

Entered the left chamber, and found that the altar was lawful! Great luck there, I don't know if I could have survived fighting two Horsemen at once. #offer and it was done. First ascension ever! This thread really motivated me and helped me to do it, couldn't have done without it! Thanks everyone!

EDIT: By the way I forgot to mention I was wearing a ring of regeneration almost continuously from the Quest level right up to the end. This ring helped TREMENDOUSLY and I doubt I could have survived without it.
 
Re: OT: Nethack

That's a noble feat that I, too, one day wish to accomplish.

[Deckard Cain voice]
"Congratulations, hero!"
[/voice]

Well played, sir! I knew a Bostonian wouldn't let us down! (My mom's from the Avon/Randolph area, FYI)
 
Re: OT: Nethack

Big congrats, azn! :thumbup:

The first is always special. Mine was also a female dwarf - a Cavewoman.


Nice luck with the first temple being the right one for you.

Regeneration rings are indeed nice. I never seem to find any. Or when I do, I no longer want/need them.
 
Re: OT: Nethack

This game is so funny. After I ascended the valk, I randomed a gnomish healer. First enemies encountered were a pair of goblins. I wasn't watching my HP and got killed. Total score: 80. :rolf:

Got too used to owning everything in melee, I guess...
 
Re: OT: Nethack

EDIT: By the way I forgot to mention I was wearing a ring of regeneration almost continuously from the Quest level right up to the end. This ring helped TREMENDOUSLY and I doubt I could have survived without it.

Gratz on ascending :). I really need to learn how to get that good at this game :P. I used to love rings of regeneration when I found them...Until I realized I starved to death every time i kept it on all the time.


 
Re: OT: Nethack

I tend to use rings of regeneration actively rather than as a set-and-forget. I put them on if I need to rest to regenerate my health (and then take them back off when I'm regenerated), or I put them on before getting in to a potentially dangerous battle (and take them back off afterwards). This mitigates the hunger cost pretty well.

By mid-late game I've generally got lots of other things I'd rather do with my fingers, and my natural regeneration is generally more than enough.

-CG
 
Re: OT: Nethack

Well, still no ID scrolls found yet. I'm pretty sure I've found almost every other scroll (though I haven't dared to read the 300 zm ones because of possible Punishment). Still plugging along.

So, a round of sacrifices netted me a Fire Brand. Is this worth spending my saved Enchant Weapon scrolls on? I hear lots of monsters are fire-resistant...

Edit: more sacrificing (hey, I had a wand of Create Monster) got me a Grayswandir. I hear that this is a very good weapon, but I can only use sabers at Basic. Plus, one can only wield one artifact at a time, yes? I'm wondering what I should use. Here's my list:
Excalibur
Grayswandir
Fire Brand
Mjollnir

Edit again:
Hilarious! I've discovered 4 coaligned altars so far (this one on dlvl 21!)

Edit 3:
LOL, dlvl 23, another coaligned altar. Yet I have yet to find a blindfold or towel...
 
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Re: OT: Nethack

Someone mentioned before that cream pies work as blindfolds if you apply it. Wipe your face to remove it. I don't know if that destroys the item, though.

I read that silver sabers are a good second weapon for #twoweapon. How to get them, that I can't help you with.

@azn: Lesson learned, eh? Funny stuff.
 
Re: OT: Nethack

Unfortunately that does indeed use up the pie. I don't have much to fear from gaze attacks thanks to reflection, but it would be nice to use telepathy at will.

I've heard the same thing about offhanding a silver saber. I'm just wondering what to use in my mainhand! Good to have choices, I guess :)

I just did my quest. It wasn't too bad, though navigating through lava and fire traps makes me nervous. Also, Lord Surtur hits like a freight train. Good thing I had a potion of full healing!

Edit: Well, I'm farther than I've ever been. Just cleared out the castle! I'm a bit scared to keep going. I wonder what I should wish for... I got my cloak of MR from a lucky sit on the castle throne, so I'm actually considering a magic marker.
 
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Re: OT: Nethack

Well, I parked my valk for a bit while thinking about what to wish for. On a lark, I decided to try out a ranger as per TRM's recommendation.

They are alright, but I think I'm missing something because although I hadn't done the quest yet, I really did run out of arrows by clvl 9 and never found a significant amount after that. So it was mostly a weak fighter (Magicbane and Stormbringer). I was doing pretty well though; was resistant to everything, had speed from a Q, etc. Made it to the castle, where I was killed by a minotaur. It nailed half my life in one hit and I couldn't dig. No idea how to deal with them at that level. I was around -10 AC which is clearly not enough. I guess you have to be lucky and have a wand of death or just hope you don't run into them till later. Heh.

146058 uJordanu-Ran-Orc-Mal-Cha died in The Dungeons of Doom
on level 25. Killed by a minotaur. - [86]
 
Re: OT: Nethack

I think training in throwing weapons (daggers, darts) is a good move early on. Finding rather large stacks is pretty easy in the early game, and like arrows you can end up throwing four in a single turn. It's only once you have access to the quest bow, some holy water, and getting a big stack of arrows to at least +5 that they stop disappearing so often.

But yeah, that minotaur. Sad way to see your ranger go. I'm sure I'll run into the same problem once I get that far into the game myself. Glad you tried it out, anyway!
 
Re: OT: Nethack

Made it to the castle, where I was killed by a minotaur. It nailed half my life in one hit and I couldn't dig. No idea how to deal with them at that level.

It would be better to have lots more HPs and better AC so you can fight them.

The minotaur in the early maze on the castle level is guaranteed, I think.

Some other options than wand of death:
- wand/spell of sleep (no guarantees, but a good chance)
- wand/spell of polymorph (it´s quite likely to turn into something less dangerous). You can even wield a polymorph potion and hit with that.
- wand of teleportation (works on monsters even on no-teleport level)
- scroll of taming/spell of charm monster (if you can´t beat them, join them!)



 
Re: OT: Nethack

Ah, thanks, those are some good ideas. Oddly enough, I've never found a wand or even potion of polymorph in all my hacking so far. Good to know about teleport always working on monsters.

I know my HP was low, but I was never able to find a nurse. Are there other reliable ways, pre-castle?

Edit: Wow, I just realized that when using Travel ('_') you can just type > or < to put the cursor on the appropriate stairs... and it was only a couple days ago I learned about shift+direction in that mode. Sheesh, I could have been saving my wrists!
 
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Re: OT: Nethack

I know my HP was low, but I was never able to find a nurse. Are there other reliable ways, pre-castle?

Other than the obvious 'gain more levels' (works even beyond level 30; you still get more HP and power), there is the (IMO) extremely useful 'drink healing potions even when you aren´t hurt (or just a little)'. Blessed full healing increases your max HP by 8, blessed extra healing increases it by 5.

In order to get more big healing potions, alchemy (mixing potions) can be very useful. There is always a 10% risk that they explode (both the dipped and one of the dipped into potions disappear).
The dipped potion should not be cursed (it always explodes if it is) but the dipped into potion (or potions) may be cursed. After a mixing, the resulting potion(s) is/are always diluted and uncursed (but not IDed as uncursed, so it´s good to have an altar close by, so you can ID them and make them stack with identified diluted ones). It´s also good to have uncursed water at hand - also so you can make more of them stack for the next dipping step.

Here are the recipes for healing potions:
* healing + speed -> extra healing
* healing + gain energy/level -> extra healing
* extra healing + gain energy/level -> full healing

When my Laura had looted the Castle and Valley of the Dead (report coming later), she could make herself enough potions to drink 9 blessed of full healing (plus I could save 3 for later use). That´s +72 HP.


(BTW, when I start a Healer, I usually drink 2 healing and 3 extra healing potions right away. Makes it a lot easier to reach level 2-3.)



 
Re: OT: Nethack

Laura the Archaeologist, Report #5, Polymorphing pleasures, looting and an unusual wish.

I have to share this screenie. This poor buddy lived only one turn in our company. Talk about having a bad day!

I lost Alf the dragon a short while after this. I got too close to a level teleporter and Alf happened to enter it and vanish. I have used telepathy to look for him on every level from 1 to 29 (Valley of the Dead) but I have not been able to find him yet. Could he actually be down in Gehennom?

Oh well, I don´t actually need a pet now for fighting, and once I learn the identify spell, I don´t need one for curse testing in the field either.

Now Laura had a long polymorphing session at her base camp in Minetown. The most interesting item types for Laura to polymorph were (in descending order):
1. spellbooks (by far the most interesting)
2. rings
3. magical tools (looking for magic markers - I brought every unicorn horn I had found)
4. magical armors (among other things, brought all elven cloaks/boots)
5. scrolls
6. potions of oil, booze, fruit juice and sickness (the ones you can´t cancel to water)

Wise from earlier characters, I now save one copy of all spellbooks for spells I want to keep using for the rest of the game. Only the others are to be polymorphed. This is the 'too good to let go of' pack. (the column to the left of the altar are the squares where I drop stuff to polymorph).

As you can see from my screenie, I did eventually get a spellbook of identify. Yay! Shortly afterwards, Camaxtli gave me a spellbook of finger of death when I prayed on the altar. I have basic skill with Attack spells, so the fail risk is exactly the same as for the cancellation spell, 37%.

I went back to Fort Ludious and polymorphed the pile where most soldiers died. Got two pairs of gloves of dexterity, but they were both +0 and I figured it wasn´t worth the EA scrolls or marker charges to enchant them up. I kept my +4 leather gloves. There was one T-shirt in the pile as well as a hawaiian shirt. I always read T-shirts. This one was not particularly funny: "Vault Guards Do It in Small, Dark Rooms". I chose the hawaiian.
(I liked "Madame Elvira´s Succubus-o-Rama Employee of the Month" I got last game a lot more.) :badteeth:

Altars on three consecutive levels (21-23) in the dungeon.

Encountered a ki-rin which managed to cast Summon Nasties. Not too many monsters appeared, though.
Being this high in level so early has its perks - the monsters will also be nastier. Which is why Laura kept those incubi waiting until she felt she was ready to handle high-level beasties.

DL 27 - Medusa level
I got the version with the titan close to the start. I rushed him in melee, and thankfully, no summoning storm.
I rolled a boulder down to one of the three water squares in the first room, then I used jumping boots to make my way across the level. Medusa killed herself when she gazed upon my shiny armor (I was also blindfolded, just in case).

DL 28 - The Castle
I lit my lamp and put on levitation boots. I used Magic Missiles to kill the four giant eels in the moat. The damage from this spell depends on character level, so Laura packs a mean punch with those. I got help from bounces on the castle walls as well. Levitated around the back, killed the dragons, found absolutely nothing cool in the four storage rooms (not uncommon if you´ve had played with pretty much unlimited polymorphs).
Wand of wishing was 0:1.

DL 29 - Valley of the Dead
Much better luck with the loot here, especially a multitude of useful potions. The first (biggest) graveyard could be looted at a calm pace, since all monsters were asleep and I am stealthy. On my way to the second graveyard, I met a cockatrice. Idiot me decided to cast Fireball on it. OK, it died alright, but the explosion woke up every damn inhabitant in those graveyards. I found a bottleneck and could face off the horde from there.

I brought all loot back to the base camp (level-teleported to DL 4 (the one with mines entrance) from the Valley using a cursed scroll of teleportation). After some more polymorphing, I finally learned how enchant weapon scrolls look like. Used one wish to get a magic marker. Recharged the wand with a blessed scroll of charging I had saved earlier. Wrote some enchant weapon scrolls and one charging (for recharging the magic marker itself - uncursed scroll works just as well as blessed for this), then some more enchant weapon. Frost Brand is now +6 and my silver sabre is +7. I want to bless them, too, but that will have to wait until I have more water.

Wrote a genocide scroll and wiped out ;

Lots of alchemy with my potions, and I could get HP up quite a bit, plus I saved three blessed full healing potions.

Since I wanted to curse several things (a 4-pack of teleport scrolls (for level teleporting) and a potion of gain level (for fast escape from Moloch´s temple)) I did something I have not done before.
Used up two of those. I have saved one holy and one unholy water in my BoH. I plan to collect more potions and cancel a pack to water. Then I can make these holy or unholy as I please, by dipping.

My spellbook collection is in an inconvenient place for the rest of the game. I should probably move it to DL4 so I can re-study what I need on the way up. Not sure if I can carry all that and still only be Burdened. Hmm, can you do controlled level-teleport if you are Stressed?
Maybe I should just bring my wand of wishing (1:2) and wish for a needed spellbook if I run out of the spell. Or I could wish for a magic marker and simply take any book I find in the fíeld, cancel it and write a new one of the needed type. I like that idea.


Demons of Gehennom, watch out!
 
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Re: OT: Nethack

Congrats on the ascension, azn_apocalypse! And congrats on the solid progress, jiansonz! Pretty crazy screenie with the incubus. Also, I'm not 100%, but I think I remember that stressed "controlled" teleport can be seriously jumpy and not quite so "controlled," so I'd definitely want to avoid that. I think you'll find yourself short on books and/or charges if you need to re-read something on the ascension run so maybe bring up the books that are absolute essentials and hold out to write the others, if necessary.

Turns out I was right about the sealed fate of my archaeologist. Healed up in the temple to full health, stepped into the doorway and was grappled by the owlbear and whacked by an ogre. Fun times.

Randomed a monk afterwards and started off fairly well, discovering identify very early from a book store and having healing as the starting book. Headed to Mine Town, hoping to buy some protection and steal some loot, and succeeded in both. Managed to identify and pilfer a wand of polymorph and change my large cat into a black dragon. Puff cleared out the shopkeepers (save for Izchak, of course) while I gathered up their gold and wares.

ID'ed a BoH and have put it to good use. Bought one round of protection, but that's all I could afford. Since the temple was cross aligned, I let the dragon clear out the priest and regained my loot. Also picked up a pair of spellbooks, waiting to be ID'ed.

Picked up a silver saber from the watch captain, for later in the game when I switch to weaponed combat (assuming I don't find something better). Have identified wands of magic missle, digging and polymorph as well as striking and am sitting on a wand that vanishes engravings. Hopefully teleport, but we'll see. Also picked up a skeleton key, a tinning kit and a magic marker. Next up will be Sokoban, because the amulet would be very helpful right now.

Honestly, I'm not very familar with monks, but I'm expecting I can clear out Mine's End by sitting back and healing the black dragon if I have reflection (and probably even if I don't, but I'd feel better with it). I'm also assuming that if the dragon does die, I can eat his corpse with no penalties other than that for eating meat. I'm not absolutely sure what my dream ascension gear for this guy is, but I'm guessing Ammy of Reflection, Cloak of MR, Grayswandir, speed boots and gauntlets of dex. I know I've heard some people wearing armor with monks in the late game, but have any of you guys done it? Is it that big of a deal with a sturdy weapon and high luck? If not, I may swing my ambitions more towards SDSM and an ammy of life saving.
 
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