zeal/avenger hybrid help a new paladin player out.

[leesh]

zeal/avenger hybrid help a new paladin player out.

I was always intrigued with the paladin that uses zeal skill and i didn't want to be limited to just physical damage so i was wondering if this is possible? btw I am a paladin noobie so bear with me if this doesn't make sense and that is why iam here to ask you pally gurus. I saw a similar post on a different forum (lurker lounge) and i got this arrangement from there but how does this look?

5 zeal
20 vengence
20 salvation
20 holy shield
20 conviction

or

20 Conviction
10 Resist Fire
10 Resist Cold
10 Resist Lightning
5+ Holy Shield
1+ Vengeance
1 in all prerequisites

or

20 conviction
4 salvation
4 resists fire
4 resists cold
4 resist lightning
5+ holy shield
1+ vengeance
1 in all prerequisistes

many thanks.

 

[Vesio]

well for starters if you are intriguied by the zeal then I would not want to be building an avenger. The only build you post there are avengers at heart. The only one that mentions zeal directly is the first one and then only with five points and nothing in the way of synergizing it; the others only mention it as a prereq for vengeance. I would recommend something more like:

20 zeal
20 sacrifice
20 fanat

this for starters. Then since you don't want to be confined to simply physical damage you can go one of two ways elemental zealot (there is a guide type thing floating around on here somewhere that you can look at for ideas.) Or you can go for vengeance. If you opt for the vengeance route i would suggest something like

1-5 vengeance
20 conviction
the rest in synergies and ultilities or holy shield.


Otherwise you might do something like

20 zeal
20 vengeance
20 fanat
20 convition
some in holy shield and then synergies and utilities as you see fit.

EDIT: On a side note for the synergies to vengeance the individual resistance auras are a much better choice. IIRC they give you two or three times as much damage per point spent than in salvation. It can be good to have a point or two in salvation just because it gives resistance to all instead of one but the synergy isn't that great.

 

[Weltkriegpally]

EDIT: On a side note for the synergies to vengeance the individual resistance auras are a much better choice. IIRC they give you two or three times as much damage per point spent than in salvation. It can be good to have a point or two in salvation just because it gives resistance to all instead of one but the synergy isn't that great.

wrong, bud. one point salvation is 6 percent enhanced damage, total, vs the 10 percent to a single element you get with the resist auras. really, you get better damage out of vengeance and salvation than you would the resist auras. well, at least better well rounded damage. individual resist auras have their advantages, of course. the plus max resist is pretty nice at times. However, to say that you get better damage out of them than vengeance itself is really not true. You get the best with vengeance, but the real reason that you can't use it well is because of its abortive mana cost. You do a lot of damage, and you pay a lot of mana. Its the reason a lot of people use that setup.

--welt

 

[Trobb]

There is a little different build that I'm trying that does use zeal and conviction.

20 Zeal
20 Holy Shield
20 Conviction

After these you can max Sacrifce for the 12% per level boost to physical damage or you can put points into individual resists auras to raise your max resists.

Vengence is a slow attack...depending on the weapon each attack is roughly twice the number of frames as each zeal attack (i.e one swing of zeal vs one swing with vengence..not the entire 5 swing sequence). The key to this build is elemental added damage from your weapon, armor and charms. Conviction lowers the resists on mobs to their lowest possible resist (-100 is max) which in effect doubles the damage of your elemental attacks. So a gimmershred flying axe which adds an ave 901 elemental damage really does 1802 added elemental damage. By attacking 2x as fast as vengence you are applying that awesome elemental damage at a much faster rate.

Also, pallys normally have problems in their attack ratings. Taking zeal beyond the 4 points needed to get the 5 max attacks adds both a damage bonus and an attack bonus. To top it off, conviction lowers the mob's defense drastically which allows the pally to hit more often. Just be aware that the added ability to hit and the additional damage due to lowering the mob's resist won't show on the character screen.

 

[Vesio]

wrong, bud. one point salvation is 6 percent enhanced damage, total, vs the 10 percent to a single element you get with the resist auras. really, you get better damage out of vengeance and salvation than you would the resist auras. well, at least better well rounded damage. individual resist auras have their advantages, of course. the plus max resist is pretty nice at times. However, to say that you get better damage out of them than vengeance itself is really not true. You get the best with vengeance, but the real reason that you can't use it well is because of its abortive mana cost. You do a lot of damage, and you pay a lot of mana. Its the reason a lot of people use that setup.

--welt

then take three points into salvation and one into each of the resist auras. the means you get 18% total damage from salvation (six to each element). On the other hand you get 30% total damage from the points in the resistance aura(10% from each element). So unless im doing my math wrong points spent in the resistance auras have a much better effect synergywise than does salvation.

oh and i didn't mean to say the synergies where better than the actual skill. I see now thats that how it reads but i didn't plan for it to be read that way.

 

[leesh]

So bascially i want to use zeal for the fast attack with a fast weapon with lots of elemental damage while using the conviction aura. Instead of maxing salvation how does

4 into salvation
4 fire
4 light
4 cold

look? am i even close to getting this right? when i normally build a character i follow a cookie cutter build and i end up tweaking and rebuilding them the way i would like it to be but because I am inexperienced with zealot/avengers i came here to find help. I was gonna just make a zealot then an avenger and fuse them together some how but i know i will end up going threw atleast 4 builds just to get it right. thanks for the help guys

 

[BlackWinterDay]

So bascially i want to use zeal for the fast attack with a fast weapon with lots of elemental damage while using the conviction aura. Instead of maxing salvation how does

4 into salvation
4 fire
4 light
4 cold

look? am i even close to getting this right? when i normally build a character i follow a cookie cutter build and i end up tweaking and rebuilding them the way i would like it to be but because I am inexperienced with zealot/avengers i came here to find help. I was gonna just make a zealot then an avenger and fuse them together some how but i know i will end up going threw atleast 4 builds just to get it right. thanks for the help guys

I have no idea what you are trying to do there. The only reason to put points into any of those auras is to synergize Vengence. If you are not using Vengence, do not put points into those auras. If you want to increase your max resists, do it through items (Guardian Angel comes to mind) and not by wasting skill points that could be used elsewhere.

If you ARE planning on using Vengence, then ignore Salvation. I don't see any reason why an Avenger should ever use Salvation as a synergy - we just don't have enough skill points. Maybe if you max Vengence AND Conviction AND all three of your resist auras, then you could consider it. Ooops, that's over 100 points right there. Like I said, Avengers just don't have enough skill points.

 

[leesh]

I have no idea what you are trying to do there. The only reason to put points into any of those auras is to synergize Vengence. If you are not using Vengence, do not put points into those auras. If you want to increase your max resists, do it through items (Guardian Angel comes to mind) and not by wasting skill points that could be used elsewhere.

If you ARE planning on using Vengence, then ignore Salvation. I don't see any reason why an Avenger should ever use Salvation as a synergy - we just don't have enough skill points. Maybe if you max Vengence AND Conviction AND all three of your resist auras, then you could consider it. Ooops, that's over 100 points right there. Like I said, Avengers just don't have enough skill points.

Wow i look like a moron. thanks for the info. So i guess there is no way for me to use zeal as an avenger and still be able to dish out alot of damage like a pure avenger?

 

[Vesio]

search for a build called the elemental zealot. That might be the answer to your problems. You still deal lots physical damage through zeal but the focus is more into the elemental side.

 

[leesh]

search for a build called the elemental zealot. That might be the answer to your problems. You still deal lots physical damage through zeal but the focus is more into the elemental side.

thank you i will look that up now and one more thing, can a avenger or elemental zealot handle diablo clone well?

 

[Vesio]

i wouldnt see why not. Any well built character can handle him in my opinion. Some are better than others to be sure but i don't forsee any problems with handling him. Although you will might have a problem dealing out the damage that you need to kill him with an avenger.

 

[Trobb]

i wouldnt see why not. Any well built character can handle him in my opinion. Some are better than others to be sure but i don't forsee any problems with handling him. Although you will might have a problem dealing out the damage that you need to kill him with an avenger.

True, Diablo clone is 50% resistant to physical and magic damage but 95% resistant to fire/cold/lightning/poison. So the more your damage is focused on the elements the harder it will be to kill him.

 

[BlackWinterDay]

True, Diablo clone is 50% resistant to physical and magic damage but 95% resistant to fire/cold/lightning/poison. So the more your damage is focused on the elements the harder it will be to kill him.

An slvl 25 Conviction will help take care of that...