The Official "Temple vs. No-Holds-Barred" Thread <

[Snake-Byte]

ok look, we don't care. This is pal vs pal
and people who are knocking other people for using tele or whatever, stop
there is no real debate here, all i see is
someone calling something stupid,
someone saying that's not stupid, then calling something else stupid... etc

I never called anything stupid. All I'm saying is by removing these "BM" items from the allowed items, you're running off alot of competition from Temple games. Open it up a little bit, be more relaxed, and unclench your anuses and it might not be such a desolate game.

If you guys INSIST on not allowing these items...

I understand that you want to keep the dueling "Fun," so don't post "TEMPLE IS OPEN" threads without first posting rules; Which I see done alot. If you do this, you can expect people to show up with dooms, exiles, atmas, etc, etc. Though they will anyway, you'll get much fewer by first posting a "RULES" list above every "TEMPLE IS OPEN" announcement.

If you're going to post these games (and no... I'm not pointing the finger at anyone, for those of you who like picking fights. Or am I rehtorically pointing my finger by saying I'm not pointing my finger? Or maybe I'm pointing my finger by saying "Or am I rehtorically pointing my finger by saying I'm not pointing my finger?"!!! No. I'm not pointing fingers, I'm offering a suggestion to lessen your BM problems, seeing as how you guys don't want to allow teleporting, BO, doom, beast, exile, draculs, etc, etc) then you should expect people to come in using what you claim to be BM items.

This is just my suggestion though, and I'm not twisting anyone's arms while duct-taping your eyelids open, forcing you to read it. Hopefully it'll cut down on some of the bickering around here about people invading temple games with their "BM" items.

 

[FoodPoisoning]

I did post the rules first smrty.
I was generalizing, I know you didn't call anything stupid
I'm sorry if you don't like the rules then go duel elsewhere, those rules are the way they were in 1.09, so you can't accuse me of hijacking temple or something
now I need to find something to call stupid...
damnit...

 

[Snake-Byte]

I did post the rules first smrty.
I was generalizing, I know you didn't call anything stupid
I'm sorry if you don't like the rules then go duel elsewhere, those rules are the way they were in 1.09, so you can't accuse me of hijacking temple or something
now I need to find something to call stupid...
damnit...

And I said I wasn't pointing fingers

I'm not saying you didn't post the rules, you did. Other people post it, and they leave the rules out. I've seen it done a number of times.

I do duel elsewhere. It's just a shame that you guys aren't opening up and dueling some of the other people out there who choose to use these items. They're really not that expensive, and as I said they add a whole new dimension to dueling. You can still keep your .09 builds, if that's what you want. But loosten up the temple "rules" a little, and try letting the people who use these items get involved. Hell, in .09 people didn't like dueling my zealot because I had an Ith Legendary mallet to substitute my ethereal fury until I could make another one. I asked them before hand if they had any qualms. Usually they didn't, so we agreed to duel. Is that so hard for people to do?

 

[FoodPoisoning]

no I'm afraid we won't open up to the new dimension of dueling as we do not like it -_-;

constant lifetap, hf, amp, 8000 life, tele, and slow does not sound very fun. It sounds to me like merely luck. I think tele unbalances some builds, and I don't see how anything else up there makes duels more fun or skillful. Maybe I'm trying to introduce other people into a whole new dimension of dueling that they have missed because of 1.10!?

I'm sorry but it aint gonna change. If no one likes it then fine. You "new age" people can go start your own game

 

[Mr.Glasscock]

I did post the rules first smrty.
I was generalizing, I know you didn't call anything stupid
I'm sorry if you don't like the rules then go duel elsewhere, those rules are the way they were in 1.09, so you can't accuse me of hijacking temple or something
now I need to find something to call stupid...
damnit...

Pick me, pick me! I'm ever so stupid!

 

[Snake-Byte]

no I'm afraid we won't open up to the new dimension of dueling as we do not like it -_-;

constant lifetap, hf, amp, 8000 life, tele, and slow does not sound very fun. It sounds to me like merely luck. I think tele unbalances some builds, and I don't see how anything else up there makes duels more fun or skillful. Maybe I'm trying to introduce other people into a whole new dimension of dueling that they have missed because of 1.10!?

I'm sorry but it aint gonna change. If no one likes it then fine. You "new age" people can go start your own game

Constant Lifetap, HF, Amp, 8,000 life, tele, and slow? I don't know about you, but I've never seen a character with over 8,000 life. My friend's assassin comes the closest, as she has 7200 life, with my oak sage, and level 18 battle orders on my druid. Still, my druid only has 4,000 life, and she only has 3300 solo. Alot of you pallies out there, im sure, are reaching 2400 without BO. So throw a cta on-switch, and there you have it. What's the big deal about that?

Merely luck? Have you tried dueling necro vs necro while both of you tele? Its more than just luck, you have to actually have some skill to be able to do that. I'll admit, bonespirits spammed at 2 screens away that turn invisible does turn it into luck, but that has nothing to do with Enigma, now does it?
You don't see how it makes them more fun, or more skillful, because you probably haven't tried it, or you can't cope with it.

I understand if you want to make a game slash league that goes back to the 1.09 version of dueling. That's perfectly alright, but the hypocritical statement in your very own post that states "All builds are welcome" With the exception of clerics or shamans or whatever it was you called them (I'm sorry, I can't keep up with the paladin forum build lingo) while explicitely forbidding items (which some people design their characters around) seems to limit the competition a bit. Like I said, you don't have to duel them, but don't ridicule them for using these items in these games. That's what I've been TRYING to get across. How is anyone whos been captivated by the "bm" dueling going to see the fun in "gm" dueling if you guys don't let them compete?

That's like saying you're going to show everyone how great your car is by keeping it parked in your garage, and then shooting at people with a shotgun when they try and come near it. It makes no sense.

Alot of the negativity floating around these items has sparked much the same way negativity about Iths sparked. n00bs who get their hands on them join these private dueling games, PK and NK everyone, and then leave with the redundant "pwnt gg k thx n00b?" as their final words. It's alot like the gun control issue facing America today. Guns don't kill people, people kill people.

Either way, it's up to you guys what you say is and isn't GM. All I'm advocating here is that by being so harsh on people who decide to use these items, you're limiting the competition floating around these games, and thus causing them to go stagnant.

Loosten up, let some of these people in, let them compete. If you don't want to duel someone who uses doom simply state "No thanks, I don't like dueling people who use Doom" and find someone else to duel with, instead of saying "OMFG DOOM IS FOR NOOBS LEAVE!!!!111one11!111" (Generalization, you should get the idea.)

 

[ROMVS]

I say we all go to the reason for the creation of Temple. Maybe Blade or the other vets can answer us on this. Why was Temple created and were any rules set like only P v P? I think the answer to the question was yes, meaning only Paladin versus Paladin.

Now as for the Bad Mannered dueling gear, I think there has to be some fairness to the dueling. For me, if I use my smiter, I want to duel a smiter or a smiter variant.

This is the pally forum as far as I know or since the last time I looked at the title way on top. So... why bring all these arguments about non-pally characters? If you want to play them, fine. If you want to duel with them, fine. However, the paladins posting Temple duels are paladins seeking to duel other paladins unless otherwise stated.

 

[Snake-Byte]

I say we all go to the reason for the creation of Temple. Maybe Blade or the other vets can answer us on this. Why was Temple created and were any rules set like only P v P? I think the answer to the question was yes, meaning only Paladin versus Paladin.

Now as for the Bad Mannered dueling gear, I think there has to be some fairness to the dueling. For me, if I use my smiter, I want to duel a smiter or a smiter variant.

This is the pally forum as far as I know or since the last time I looked at the title way on top. So... why bring all these arguments about non-pally characters? If you want to play them, fine. If you want to duel with them, fine. However, the paladins posting Temple duels are paladins seeking to duel other paladins unless otherwise stated.

I'm using them to state an argument. You can just as easily apply the same problems from elemental druids, or teleing necros to hammerdins, or FoHers. Even smiters. Again, all I'm saying is loosten up. If you don't want to duel a FoHer in temple, fine. If you don't want to duel hammerdins in temple, fine. If you don't want to duel someone who uses Doom, fine. What's the fuss?

 

[Stoutwood]

I'm just impressed with the sheer number of responses that this thread got in the short time its been up. Obviously there's been a lot of pent-up resentment between groups 1 and 2 since 1.10 came out. Interesting. Just let everyone blow off their steam in here Food, that way they won't do it in the Temple thread. I'm going to plead the 5th for this discussion, although everyone here undoubtedly knows where I stand.

 

[ROMVS]

I'm using them to state an argument. You can just as easily apply the same problems from elemental druids, or teleing necros to hammerdins, or FoHers. Even smiters. Again, all I'm saying is loosten up. If you don't want to duel a FoHer in temple, fine. If you don't want to duel hammerdins in temple, fine. If you don't want to duel someone who uses Doom, fine. What's the fuss?

Exactly my point Snake. Thanks, I'm glad you understand. Maybe there could be a new room like Pala vs all? That would at least keep Temple to just pally vs pally.

By the way, many casters like picking on Paladins because they think easy kill. Although many will argue contrary to that, I don't wish to make that point. I just don't want a non-pally to come into Temple when I'm in a middle of a good-mannered pally vs pally duel which I can't find elsewhere.
(Edit King strikes again.)

 

[Snake-Byte]

Exactly my point Snake. Thanks, I'm glad you understand. Maybe there could be a new room like Pala vs all? That would at least keep Temple to just pally vs pally.

By the way, many casters like picking on Paladins because they think easy kill. Although many will argue contrary to that, I don't wish to make that point. I just don't want a non-pally to come into Temple when I'm in a middle of a good-mannered pally vs pally duel which I can't find elsewhere.
(Edit King strikes again.)

Oh, I understand wanting to have mannered paladin duels. I used to do it myself in .09 quite often. I just don't see why everyone is in such an uproar about people using these "BM" items. Just ask politely for them to unhostile you, and all the problems are resolved (usually).

 

[Mr.Glasscock]

The problem is that rarely are they resolved easily. It'd be nice and pleasant if with one simple comment they'd take off their bm gear, or unhostile you.

But that's not the case; like many players on the forums they just blame us not using bm stuff because we can't afford it. It's the same in games: "you cant afford it, so just be quiet and duel or leave" And they've been known to say this in games that we non-bm'ers make.

I have only seen about 3-4 good mannered Doom users/hammerdin/(all those other builds) that kindly unhost you, or get new equipment. We wouldn't be having this problem of banning items if people would have some common sense and realize how it takes most of the skill and challenge away when both persons dont have 3 auras going at once/1k life more/more def/ etc.

It's a nice thought Snake, but it's not going to happen any time soon.

 

[FoodPoisoning]

Constant Lifetap, HF, Amp, 8,000 life, tele, and slow? I don't know about you, but I've never seen a character with over 8,000 life. My friend's assassin comes the closest, as she has 7200 life, with my oak sage, and level 18 battle orders on my druid. Still, my druid only has 4,000 life, and she only has 3300 solo. Alot of you pallies out there, im sure, are reaching 2400 without BO. So throw a cta on-switch, and there you have it. What's the big deal about that?

Merely luck? Have you tried dueling necro vs necro while both of you tele? Its more than just luck, you have to actually have some skill to be able to do that. I'll admit, bonespirits spammed at 2 screens away that turn invisible does turn it into luck, but that has nothing to do with Enigma, now does it?
You don't see how it makes them more fun, or more skillful, because you probably haven't tried it, or you can't cope with it.

I understand if you want to make a game slash league that goes back to the 1.09 version of dueling. That's perfectly alright, but the hypocritical statement in your very own post that states "All builds are welcome" With the exception of clerics or shamans or whatever it was you called them (I'm sorry, I can't keep up with the paladin forum build lingo) while explicitely forbidding items (which some people design their characters around) seems to limit the competition a bit. Like I said, you don't have to duel them, but don't ridicule them for using these items in these games. That's what I've been TRYING to get across. How is anyone whos been captivated by the "bm" dueling going to see the fun in "gm" dueling if you guys don't let them compete?

That's like saying you're going to show everyone how great your car is by keeping it parked in your garage, and then shooting at people with a shotgun when they try and come near it. It makes no sense.

Alot of the negativity floating around these items has sparked much the same way negativity about Iths sparked. n00bs who get their hands on them join these private dueling games, PK and NK everyone, and then leave with the redundant "pwnt gg k thx n00b?" as their final words. It's alot like the gun control issue facing America today. Guns don't kill people, people kill people.

Either way, it's up to you guys what you say is and isn't GM. All I'm advocating here is that by being so harsh on people who decide to use these items, you're limiting the competition floating around these games, and thus causing them to go stagnant.

Loosten up, let some of these people in, let them compete. If you don't want to duel someone who uses doom simply state "No thanks, I don't like dueling people who use Doom" and find someone else to duel with, instead of saying "OMFG DOOM IS FOR NOOBS LEAVE!!!!111one11!111" (Generalization, you should get the idea.)

1. It's pal vs pal smrty
2. I have had 8k life with bo and oaksage
3. I have not said one harsh word to anyone because they are "bm"
4. I'm sorry the WHOLE POINT of temple is "mannered" duels. We don't want them here period, like I said about 20 times, IF YOU DONT LIKE IT GO ELSEWHERE, NO ONE IN TEMPLE IS GOING TO WANT TO DUEL YOU. THE WHOLE POINT OF THIS GAME IS TO HAVE A GAME TO DUEL IN WITHOUT THOSE PEOPLE. make your own game damnit, maybe the people who duel in temple will join!?
5. I'm sorry if you don't like my phrase, I was refering to the char (what I would consider a build) rather than the gear. You can have a cleric or whatever without those items. If you have a lifetap holyfreeze "build" for your cleric I'm sorry

I am completely SICK of this stupid arguing. I have said like 20 times, YOU DON'T LIKE THE RULES MAKE YOUR OWN GAME. MAYBE SOME OF US PEOPLE FROM TEMPLE WILL JOIN YOUR GAME. DON'T LIKE IT THEN LEAVE.

There is nothing more to debate here, there never was

 

[FoodPoisoning]

The problem is that rarely are they resolved easily. It'd be nice and pleasant if with one simple comment they'd take off their bm gear, or unhostile you.

But that's not the case; like many players on the forums they just blame us not using bm stuff because we can't afford it. It's the same in games: "you cant afford it, so just be quiet and duel or leave" And they've been known to say this in games that we non-bm'ers make.

I have only seen about 3-4 good mannered Doom users/hammerdin/(all those other builds) that kindly unhost you, or get new equipment. We wouldn't be having this problem of banning items if people would have some common sense and realize how it takes most of the skill and challenge away when both persons dont have 3 auras going at once/1k life more/more def/ etc.

It's a nice thought Snake, but it's not going to happen any time soon.

not to mention, they take up space...

 

[sbc84]

Faster? How so? Their cast rates are almost identical (if not identical). Come quickly to attack as a hammerdin? Because your hammer appears at the 10 o clock position, that gives the necro time to shoot you and teleport. It's not as if you could ever get close enough to have your hammer hit him right as it is cast, since a necro shouldn't be standing still for so long. Someone with a good necro, I haven't played for months. I don't even remember my hotkeys. Ask the other guys or visit the necro forum. I'm sure they can pull someone out to duel you.

I had many duels vs good necros that I know b4, and 7 or 8 duels vs a good necro on this forum. When I'm talking about good necros, I mean the ones that move around timely, not the ones that spam more than once before moving.

Paladin has the same cast rate has necro, and 1 or 2 frames faster than druid. If you dont cast more than one hammer each tele, it is hard for a necro to hit you with teeth, spear or bs. If the necro tries to cast more than one attack each tele, it is easier to hit him.

As you can see, too many tele hammerdins are playing like tele-alot noobadins and picking on melees or weaker builds. Otherwise, you would see more posts about matchups of hammerdin vs other top/overpowering classes such as necro.

 

[sbc84]

Players with tele caster like hammerdins, bone necros or wind druids join and hostile weaker builds in temple should not be taken seriously. But unlike 1.09 where paladin could not overcome some other classes, 1.10 tele hammerdin can give the top casters (necro, wind druid) serious challenge. So if they (the other classses) bring in their best build wanting a good duel, why not give them one?

 

[HandofElysium]

Exactly my point Snake. Thanks, I'm glad you understand. Maybe there could be a new room like Pala vs all? That would at least keep Temple to just pally vs pally.

By the way, many casters like picking on Paladins because they think easy kill. Although many will argue contrary to that, I don't wish to make that point. I just don't want a non-pally to come into Temple when I'm in a middle of a good-mannered pally vs pally duel which I can't find elsewhere.
(Edit King strikes again.)

Thats the reason why I joined CH cause my expectations are there for me to duel people that know what they are getting into. Temple is a private game created long before I started playing and most of the people on here. The room is a place for pal vs pal enthusiasts come to enjoy the art of pal vs pal dueling. I think opening up the pal vs all just kinda ruins the whole aspect of why it was created.

If you want vs all with similiar rules to temple then CH is a suggestion because it's very well organized and you can go in knowing you don't have worry about the pubby setups that most of bnet has.

Also another aspect of dueling people should get into is low level dueling. Less item dependecy and less cookie cutter gear. I highly suggest it as it can be just as fun if not more fun than regular dueling.

 

[LovelyGods]

i've had 8k life tooo..

 

[mrJ]

*Cough 10k cough*

Cookie please :bow:

 

[Vindi66]

Players with tele caster like hammerdins, bone necros or wind druids join and hostile weaker builds in temple should not be taken seriously. But unlike 1.09 where paladin could not overcome some other classes, 1.10 tele hammerdin can give the top casters (necro, wind druid) serious challenge. So if they (the other classses) bring in their best build wanting a good duel, why not give them one?

Do you not understand the temple is PAL VS PAL. Enough with the necro and druid stuff. It has nothing to do with the topic. Nobody here cares if your hammerdin can beat necros.