PvM 1.13 ExplosionMancer guide

[Abhorsen]

Re: PvM 1.13 ExplosionMancer guide

How would one max resistance ? Carry a ton of resist all charms?

I have torch + anni and I still only have maybe 15-30 resist in hell vs most everything. :|

I have almost all of the gear from the suggested gear list except for the amy and rings.

 

[spraycleaner]

Re: PvM 1.13 ExplosionMancer guide

Hey nice guide. I will try this build. Looking for all those items doesn't seem that bad lol

 

[crawlingdeadman1]

Re: PvM 1.13 ExplosionMancer guide

How would one max resistance ? Carry a ton of resist all charms?

I have torch + anni and I still only have maybe 15-30 resist in hell vs most everything. :|

I have almost all of the gear from the suggested gear list except for the amy and rings.

he had a couple lists of suggested gear, which're you using? basically, pick a couple pieces of gear and dedicate res to them (like kira's or wizzy) or spread it around and have every single piece of gear have res. my guy uses:

shako (sockted with a 3mpk jewel)
rare ammy: 2nec/20dex/30poison res/28 mf
40% hoto (yay first perfect one for me ever)
skulders (no socket yet, was using one with a 12 ares jewel)
pdiamond homunc
trangs
fcr/20 fres/misc mods rare
tgod's
fcr/15 cres/misc mods rare
rare boots: fhr/17cres/24 lres/23% mf

switch is naj's puzzler

my inventory only uses 3 grands and 3 small charms: gheeds is one gc and the rest are single res charms. no anni, no torch, i'm on SP HC listed res are 75/75/80/69. even with all that gear dedicated to res i still maintain a respectable 260% mf. i would have a bit more, but i recently switched to tgods from tal's belt (or was it goldwrap, idk edit: i remember now, i had been using IK belt/boots for a bit of mf, good frw, res and other nice stuff).

as you can see i deviated from the suggested use of white and went with hoto to help my res. everything else except the skulders and the shako have some res on them somewhere. you should have zero trouble with getting your res if you have a torch and an anni.

 

[mackscynox]

Re: PvM 1.13 ExplosionMancer guide

i have um'd 35@ vipermagi, a 12@res nec circlet and 20@maras. i have ~90@ res in hell (shows 75 of course). not sure if this necro is good for mfing.

i did a few wsk clears with this necro and loved it. it is a bit slow vs other builds but dont care, this is fun. requires some tactics for some monsters especially fast, strong monsters. i gave 1 pt to revive and also play like a fishy. i dont explode the bloodlords and revive them. they prove good tanks. i found attract useless or i couldnot use it well. dim vision is better for souls. once one of them dies amp+CE, they all die

one think i could not do is, my necro cannot clear baal waves, i tried to use walls/prisons but no use, if i dont have a max count revive i generally cant clear waves (merc dies fast there even with good gear).

any suggestion for waves?

 

[crawlingdeadman1]

Re: PvM 1.13 ExplosionMancer guide

i have um'd 35@ vipermagi, a 12@res nec circlet and 20@maras. i have ~90@ res in hell (shows 75 of course). not sure if this necro is good for mfing.

i did a few wsk clears with this necro and loved it. it is a bit slow vs other builds but dont care, this is fun. requires some tactics for some monsters especially fast, strong monsters. i gave 1 pt to revive and also play like a fishy. i dont explode the bloodlords and revive them. they prove good tanks. i found attract useless or i couldnot use it well. dim vision is better for souls. once one of them dies amp+CE, they all die

one think i could not do is, my necro cannot clear baal waves, i tried to use walls/prisons but no use, if i dont have a max count revive i generally cant clear waves (merc dies fast there even with good gear).

any suggestion for waves?

baals are easy enough, but i have a few questions:
-what level are you?
-other players or just you?
-what's the rest of your gear?

prison! if your merc dies, you're not using prison enough. you can easily prison a mob and if your merc accidentally gets prisoned in with one or two, so much the better. if your prison isnt strong enough, are you missing points in it? revives are a waste of time for this build, imo. i cannot remember, but do they get in the way of casting prison?

you dont like attract, have you tried confuse? dim vision is okay, but if the monster already has targeted something, DV does absolutely nothing.

if you're going to "play like a fishy" make a fishy. with out knowing more, i'd say half the trouble you're having is tactics.

 

[Black Lotus]

Re: PvM 1.13 ExplosionMancer guide

merc dies fast there even with good gear

Which gear do you call "good"? My merc is able to kill waves without skellies or walls or whatever, just amplify damage+CE, can send you a video (26mb, can I upload it to somewhere?) +with baal kill too.
I use infinity+fortitude+andy face, but I guess obedience in eth elite polearm (thresher) and treachery will give the same result here, both are stupid cheap and effective as hell. Maybe I miss something (are you on realms, or play single?) then sorry =).

 

[mackscynox]

Re: PvM 1.13 ExplosionMancer guide

baals are easy enough, but i have a few questions:
-what level are you?
-other players or just you?
-what's the rest of your gear?

prison! if your merc dies, you're not using prison enough. you can easily prison a mob and if your merc accidentally gets prisoned in with one or two, so much the better. if your prison isnt strong enough, are you missing points in it? revives are a waste of time for this build, imo. i cannot remember, but do they get in the way of casting prison?

you dont like attract, have you tried confuse? dim vision is okay, but if the monster already has targeted something, DV does absolutely nothing.


if you're going to "play like a fishy" make a fishy. with out knowing more, i'd say half the trouble you're having is tactics.

level: 87
players: p3, but solo (ladder, not sp)
gear: 12@/20dex/2nec/minor mod circlet, 35+um viper, 3BS white, 20@maras, silkweave, pdia+homonculus, trang belt+gloves, nec torch+anni, 3posnbone skiller gc, some life small charms to fill spaces, random fcr rings
merc: a2 prayer, eth ca insight, eth um-gladiators, eth iasjw-vampgaze
skills: max'd BS, BW, CE, 1pt to curses (not all), 1pt to revive and golem mastery, preq, rest in BP (maxed is 37 and BP is 35, 2 level more and maxed)

prison? dont use much but why should i prison a frenzy bloodlord with my merc i dont get it, bloodlord will swiftly kill my merc (it does). or lister pack already kills the merc on a few hit. will try prisoning them but still dont get it.

i only use DV against souls, nothing else. confuse also works but DV is better for them. targeting is not a problem as they go to melee. confused soul still shoots lite and sometimes it shoots me on the way even confused and targetted another soul/monster.

EDIT: @BlackLotus, just saw your message while i was writing answer to CDM. i said "good" gear, not "godly"

do you tele away your merc or reversely tele top of the monsters? (so use enigma?)
does wave 3 the hydras hurt your merc? or not?
can your merc single handedly kill lister and his pack (amplified)?
is it p1 or more?

one thing i found is i can immobilize monsters with bone prison if cast more than once (like filling screen). is it how you use bone prison?

 

[Kalsten]

Re: PvM 1.13 ExplosionMancer guide

I am trying to do a untwinked necro using this guide. At this moment is pretty soon (I am still lvl 25) but I have a question:

In bosses, how do you kill Baal, or Duriel, or Diablo itself? I mean, there are not corpses to explode near them, so you have to use only the bone spear?

 

[crawlingdeadman1]

Re: PvM 1.13 ExplosionMancer guide

level: 87
players: p3, but solo (ladder, not sp)
gear: 12@/20dex/2nec/minor mod circlet, 35+um viper, 3BS white, 20@maras, silkweave, pdia+homonculus, trang belt+gloves, nec torch+anni, 3posnbone skiller gc, some life small charms to fill spaces, random fcr rings
merc: a2 prayer, eth ca insight, eth um-gladiators, eth iasjw-vampgaze
skills: max'd BS, BW, CE, 1pt to curses (not all), 1pt to revive and golem mastery, preq, rest in BP (maxed is 37 and BP is 35, 2 level more and maxed)

prison? dont use much but why should i prison a frenzy bloodlord with my merc i dont get it, bloodlord will swiftly kill my merc (it does). or lister pack already kills the merc on a few hit. will try prisoning them but still dont get it.

i only use DV against souls, nothing else. confuse also works but DV is better for them. targeting is not a problem as they go to melee. confused soul still shoots lite and sometimes it shoots me on the way even confused and targetted another soul/monster.

EDIT: @BlackLotus, just saw your message while i was writing answer to CDM. i said "good" gear, not "godly"

do you tele away your merc or reversely tele top of the monsters? (so use enigma?)
does wave 3 the hydras hurt your merc? or not?
can your merc single handedly kill lister and his pack (amplified)?
is it p1 or more?

one thing i found is i can immobilize monsters with bone prison if cast more than once (like filling screen). is it how you use bone prison?

prisoning your merc with one or two bloodlords is preferable to letting him get surrounded by the whole pack. he should be able to deal with that many.

for lister's pack you have no excuse you know it's coming. put up a wall before the wave starts, stand towards the back, making sure your idiot is back there with you. when they hit the wall start spamming prison all over them, locking them down. with luck your merc will be able to hit one of them w/o taking too many hits. i like to decrep them since your merc will likely be decreped from baal, it evens the playing field. spear till one or two dies ( i usually adjust myself so that i'm hitting the same guy my merc as well as a couple behind it), then amp+CE. if more dont die, keep it up till they do, refreshing prison and all that if needed.

getting hit with a couple shots isnt anything to worry about. DV, confuse, attract, it all comes down to preference.

I am trying to do a untwinked necro using this guide. At this moment is pretty soon (I am still lvl 25) but I have a question:

In bosses, how do you kill Baal, or Duriel, or Diablo itself? I mean, there are not corpses to explode near them, so you have to use only the bone spear?

spear them, yep. you have help from a merc, decrep, and clay golem. they take a while to kill generally, but you should be safe.

 

[hyuj]

Re: PvM 1.13 ExplosionMancer guide

How important is decrep and attract to have in a wand? I am shopping in Drognan, mainly looking for + bone spear and + corpse explosion.

I will have to wait until nightmare so i can reset normal map because right now the exit is far from drognan lol.

I want to use + spear or corpse or both instead of having decrep and attract, is it ok? How important are they?

EDIT: I have a wand with +1 all necro skill , Ignore Target Defense, +1 decrep +1 attract. I wonder if this is what i should use? Am i missing alot not using +x bone spear or corpse explosion? Or should I just go with drognan wand?

 

[crawlingdeadman1]

Re: PvM 1.13 ExplosionMancer guide

i placed hard points into the curses i wanted, but that's just me.

 

[Black Lotus]

Re: PvM 1.13 ExplosionMancer guide

How important is decrep and attract to have in a wand?

This is for pvp, where every 10 damage make sense. I guess if you play single, you are free to spend hard points in curses and still own the game without those 10 extra damage. Not sure how much damage is it exactly, but every +3 bone spear should be enough for white rw.

 

[zrk]

Re: PvM 1.13 ExplosionMancer guide

The main curse for bonemancer is Amp anyway - bone spells do such low damage that you need your merc to pull the weight 100% of the time: merc does much more damage than a lvl 50-55 bone spear.

Which is why its even more surprising that the guide takes the support-mercenary angle instead of a damage brute - it plays to the build weakness rather than strengths. Same with not even mentioning beast as a weapon option when its the damage optimal choice - given how merc can do 100k dps while bone spells merely 15k.

 

[crawlingdeadman1]

Re: PvM 1.13 ExplosionMancer guide

if he was going to hold beast or focus on a merc he'd be making a different character, a summon nec. he focused on the "weakness" of bone spells because he's building a version of a Bonemancer.

 

[hyuj]

Re: PvM 1.13 ExplosionMancer guide

So I can put hard points to attract and decrep right? And I assume they are ok to have but not compulsory?

Also, if +3 Bone Spear wand is too hard to shop, is it ok to go with +2 BS?

 

[zrk]

Re: PvM 1.13 ExplosionMancer guide

That would be a methodological misunderstanding on what constitutes a premise of a build. The common condition - gear being means to ends constituted by the most efficient application of the skills chose. Following from this, it would indeed be correct to make the corrections i sugggested.

The alternative option, could conceivably be considered, however it lacks rigor for applying to other builds, and as such is a methodology for ends rather than methodology for conditions that define knowledge.

 

[hyuj]

Re: PvM 1.13 ExplosionMancer guide

ok ok.....not everyone knows that high level english...dont be selfish, not everyone speaks english...

Why cant you just use everyday english?

So I can put hard points to attract and decrep right? And I assume they are ok to have but not compulsory?

Also, if +3 Bone Spear wand is too hard to shop, is it ok to go with +2 BS?

 

[mouseman1]

Re: PvM 1.13 ExplosionMancer guide

Abhorsen: You have been shopping the wrong kind of wands. You should use normal drognan and concentrate on bone wands - they are the only wands from drognan that can spawn 2 sockets in the shop or with larzuk quest reward. When you look only bone wands, it speeds up the shopping quite much.

crawlingdeadman: Thank you so much for answering so many questions in my build's thread.

Kalsten: Bosses can be quite hard, but there are ways around them. If you use decreptify on bosses and have your mercenary and clay golem at hand, it should be alright. Try to get the boss to target your clay golem - you can always recast it if it dies and the boss will be further slowed from hitting your clay golem. If your mercenary is free to hit the boss uninterrupted with some crushing blow, they will go down fast with a steady stream of bone spears.

hyuj: Yes, if you don't have the perfect wand I would advise you to put hard points to decrepify and attract (or dim vision, if that's your thing). Also, use the best wand you have - if it's +2BS as a 'white' runeword base, then it is. Use the best gear available and try to get better gear - that's kind of the point of the game, right?

zrk: I think we've had this discussion before, right? You are certainly allowed to make any build you want and consider optimal. I don't want to censor in any way the discussion here, but I would ask you to consider other factors involved when considering the "optimal".

It is somewhat easy to calculate damage on paper, but you also have to take into account the gaming experience - how one build plays. This is what I've been saying from the start and why I made a video about it. I really liked how this build plays in real gaming situations and not just on paper.

Now, I haven't tried your "mercenary explosionmancer", but I would think you would have a hard time controlling your mercenaries killings. With bonespear you can target an enemy behind the ranks and blow up the exact monster you want - being completely safe yourself behind your hirelings, walls and curses.

In another words, you are calculating a theoretical damage per second, but you are not taking into account that mercenary damage per second is inflicted by computer AI and not by the player. Because the player is able to constantly make the right decision, and not wandering around like the mercenary does quite often, I argue that bonespear route is more effective in the real gameplay situation than building your character around the AI of a mercenary. I further argue that making your own decisions with bonespear makes the gaming experience to be more fun and fulfilling - and that's what is it all about, right?

You are also putting too much emphasis on the importance of the first kill. The monsters don't have 100k hitpoints for your buffed mercenary - bonespear does the first kill quite well and you can set up the chain reaction of exploding corpses from the point you see fit. Also, one of the perks of synergized bonespear is the bone armor that gives this build even more safety.

I invented a build of total control. When I was playing my corpsemancer, I was in total control of what happened in the screen with my curses and spells. I knew I could not die. That feeling is what I'm "selling" here. So I don't know what is "optimal" to you, but I can say according to my own experience, that the way this build plays is certainly an optimal way of enjoying the game, at least for me. You are free to try it and free to try something else if you didn't like it.

 

[gromanjr]

Re: PvM 1.13 ExplosionMancer guide

i just respeced my summon necro to this...WOW!!! i knew before that CE was an awesome skill to use to clear areas, but i never thought of doing just that with BS... I must say...this build kills almost faster than my 125fcr hammerdin.

Obviously not quite as much of a tank as having half an inventory full of +20 life scs for mf, but man...this build KILLS in pvm. :crazyeyes:

edit: BTW +++rep for you mouseman, been lurking on these forums for awhile and i must say your build for this necro that i accidentally stumbled upon, is VERY refresshing and fun to me. i havent had this much fun playing d2 in quite some time...thank you!

 

[crawlingdeadman1]

Re: PvM 1.13 ExplosionMancer guide

That would be a methodological misunderstanding on what constitutes a premise of a build. The common condition - gear being means to ends constituted by the most efficient application of the skills chose. Following from this, it would indeed be correct to make the corrections i sugggested.

The alternative option, could conceivably be considered, however it lacks rigor for applying to other builds, and as such is a methodology for ends rather than methodology for conditions that define knowledge.

awesome, so you do math poorly and now you've branched out into using english poorly, good show sir :thumbup:.

a character build's end is to have fun. more than a few people dont have fun waiting on their merc to kill something so that they can then spam CE. if i wanted to wait, i'd buld a summoner. i have mentioned before that Bone Spear does enough damage to kill and that rarely do i wait on my merc to kill something.