"Enough strength to wear your equipment"?

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BlargX

New member
"Enough strength to wear your equipment"?

One of the things making me nutty lately is everywhere you see strength discussed in threads, or even in guides, you see how much strength you should get is "enough to wear your equipment." This is kind of boggling as a non-twink newbie. I don't know how how much strength I will need for equipment, what kind of equipment I will be likely to get, or what kind of strength-boosting stuff I may eventually get to help out.

This is even more confusing when I see people discussing how great the homonculus shield is, and that you need such sky-high dexterity to use it, that a guy said he "made a mistake" by putting getting his strength to 45. 45? That's a really small boost. Now I'm scared to put very much into strength at all, just because I don't want to make a permanent mistake so early in my necro's career, if points are really so crazy tight. To top it off, I don't even know if I will ever get a homunculus anyway. (I only play SP.) FWIW, I have spent no points outside of enough to take my strength to 41, which was just enough to wear a cool rare armor drop, and am at 30 now with something like 114 or so spare points, last I looked.

Can anyone give some advice? I just really don't know how to judge here. And the strength needed to use armors is going up, while I'm still using almost entirely stuff I found at like level 14.
 
I'm currently playing Single Player as well, and I couldn't care less if I put too much points in strength. Points aren't tight at all, unless you PvP. Don't be afraid to put some points in strength, especially for your magic finders. You'll probably don't know what your final setup will look like, so you need to keep a little room for heavier stuff. I did, and I was able to equip my newly found Skullder's Ire right away.

Also, keep in mind you don't have access to an Annihilus and Torches, so almost no build will get away with putting at least some points in them...
 
Thanks. Hard to keep in mind things like the availability of Annihilus and Torches, though, since I don't even know what they are. :) From what you say, though, I gather you have to play online to get them, or trade for them.

The points being tight I got from people talking about using the homunculus, and needing 200 or even 235 points in dex to wear one, and that guy saying putting 45 points into strength turned out to be a mistake he regrets. I hate to make mistakes I can't take back, because I get attached to my characters and really want to make them good.
 
As I understand it, the high dex is only for blocking. Per the Arreat Summit, Homunculus has no dex requirement, and str req of only 58.

Personally, both my Skellymancers (currently L75 and L68) only have 30 str. (Enough to wear a Breast Plate - the lowest str req armor that can have 3 sockets.) If I ever find a 4os eth Gothic Plate, I'll probably up that to whatever is needed to wear it. (55 or thereabouts IIRC.) But I don't think I'd ever go beyond 58 (for a Homunculus) - for a SkellyMancer at least.
 
BlargX said:
Thanks. Hard to keep in mind things like the availability of Annihilus and Torches, though, since I don't even know what they are. :) From what you say, though, I gather you have to play online to get them, or trade for them.

The points being tight I got from people talking about using the homunculus, and needing 200 or even 235 points in dex to wear one, and that guy saying putting 45 points into strength turned out to be a mistake he regrets. I hate to make mistakes I can't take back, because I get attached to my characters and really want to make them good.
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Yeah torches/annihilus are both online only, worth potentially 40 stat points which is why you don't need to put that many into it online. SP is different though, obviously you can't get ideal choices as easily. Just save up points and distribute them as required, probably the best way rather than giving specific totals. That many dex points will be referring to getting max block rather than just wearing it.


 
MasterMynd said:
If I ever find a 4os eth Gothic Plate, I'll probably up that to whatever is needed to wear it. (55 or thereabouts IIRC.)
Click to expand...

An ethereal Gothic Plate will need 60 strenght to use, but why would you want it ethereal? I'd go for a normal one with a requirement of 70 strength.

As a rule of thumb, for magic finders you'll probably want to aim for 70 strength so that you can wear a Gothic Plate (with four perfect Topazes), the lightest armor that can have four sockets. 97 strength if you're lucky enough to have access to a Skullder's Ire.



 
In untwinked, I always follow the same idea:

Melee chars
Get strength up to 55 by lvl 20, so I can wear most types of normal armor (Splint Mail, Light Plate) and some exceptional (e.g. Mage Plate). By lvl 40 get it to 75. From that moment onwards keep saving 30-ish stat points in case I find something with a high strength requirement. By lvl 70 I know what equipment I will use until the end, and may put a bit more in strength. I never go higher than 146, which is what you need to use a Monarch (shield). Simply ignore any armor that's higher than that. Save and use any charm you find with strength bonuses.

Casters
Get strength up to 30 early, so you can wear a Breast Plate. Get it to 55 around lvl 40, so you can wear a Mage Plate. Leave it there; you don't need defense and a MP gives you 3 sockets which is enough because you won't find the runes for the 4-socket runewords anyway.

Ranged attackers
Same as casters, but around clvl 60 get your strength to 75, and keep 15 points in reserve. This way you equip most exceptional / elite bows that you'll find (I focus on Ward and Blade bows as much as possible).
 
People want to minimise strength so they can maximise there life because it keeps them alive/makes them tough.

Lots of Necs wear nigma with provides lots of strength. They put stats in vital instead.
 
Arkardo said:
An ethereal Gothic Plate will need 60 strenght to use, but why would you want it ethereal?
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Simply because of the reduced requirements. I'd prefer to put the extra 10 points into Vitality. No other reason. But then I'm playing HC, so it would obviously be different in SC.

Ed from Russia said:
CastersGet strength up to 30 early, so you can wear a Breast Plate. Get it to 55 around lvl 40, so you can wear a Mage Plate. Leave it there; you don't need defense and a MP gives you 3 sockets which is enough because you won't find the runes for the 4-socket runewords anyway.
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If "you don't need defense", then why not just stick with the 30 required for a Breast Plate (also 3 sockets) and put those 25 points into something that you do need?


 
MasterMynd said:
If "you don't need defense", then why not just stick with the 30 required for a Breast Plate (also 3 sockets) and put those 25 points into something that you do need?
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Good point, I guess it's a matter of habit. Plus, Breast Plates look good.
Another thing to consider would be resale value. People are more likely to trade for a Enigma Mage Plate than for an Enigma Quilted Armor (yes I know this is not possible because of the sockets)



 
BlargX said:
One of the things making me nutty lately is everywhere you see strength discussed in threads, or even in guides, you see how much strength you should get is "enough to wear your equipment." This is kind of boggling as a non-twink newbie. I don't know how how much strength I will need for equipment, what kind of equipment I will be likely to get, or what kind of strength-boosting stuff I may eventually get to help out.

This is even more confusing when I see people discussing how great the homonculus shield is, and that you need such sky-high dexterity to use it, that a guy said he "made a mistake" by putting getting his strength to 45. 45? That's a really small boost. Now I'm scared to put very much into strength at all, just because I don't want to make a permanent mistake so early in my necro's career, if points are really so crazy tight. To top it off, I don't even know if I will ever get a homunculus anyway. (I only play SP.) FWIW, I have spent no points outside of enough to take my strength to 41, which was just enough to wear a cool rare armor drop, and am at 30 now with something like 114 or so spare points, last I looked.

Can anyone give some advice? I just really don't know how to judge here. And the strength needed to use armors is going up, while I'm still using almost entirely stuff I found at like level 14.
Click to expand...

Trust me, if you're a noob at this game, just play it how you want and you'll learn along the way what all of this means. Most people who have played this game for years know exactly how they want thier level 80+ character to be and thus they already have the high level gear and know the requirements to use them. Also, many people use a hellfire torch and an annihilus which add an extra 20-40 to all stats once they reach level 75.

So thus a lot of people just rush their character through hell and sit in chaos games leveling until they hit 75. When doing this they don't spend a single point into any stats so they will have around 400 to work with at level 75. Then when their torch/annihilus stat boost kicks in at level 75 it looks like this:

*example, I don't know the exact base stats of each character
Str: Goes from 25 to 65
Dex: Goes from 20 to 60
Vita: Goes from 30 to 70
Energy: Goes from 15 to 55

Then you check out all of your gear, find the one with the lowest strength, equip it if you can, if you can't, add the necessary strength (and or dex) required to use it until you can. Then you see if that item gave you any stat bonuses and you equip your next highest requirement gear and you keep going until everything is equipped. (Often referred to as "glitching" as well and can give your character a naked look to other players)

Once all of your "end game" items are equipped, you would add all of your remaining points into either dexterity (for max block) or vitality for highest possible life.

Now, if you are just starting out in this game then you won't have access to any "end game" gear so you could just add in stat points into whatever you deem reasonable to wear some of the gear you have and it doesn't really matter because later down the line when you get some better items, you can remake your character or start new ones using the above method.



 
Thanks, SirBeetle. I'll keep that stuff in mind. I hate the idea of remaking a high level character I've grown to love, but I guess anything is possible.

And I never knew why people saved all their stat points. I thought it was just to increase the challenge or for laughs or something.
 
The "enough strength to wear equipment", as well as the "everything into vita" sentiments are usually only vital to PvP builds. People who write PvP guides generally assume that the reader knows what the best setups for most builds are, and such characters aren't played through the game the ordinary way - they're rushed through and leech off of speed-runs until they're level 60+ and can actually wear the final equipment. If you're not doing PvP then it's not super important to keep all stats besides vitality as close to base as possible, at least not when playing softcore.

If you can't afford top-end equipment for your character, bringing him into PvP isn't a great idea. You can do so of course, but you're not really gonna beat anyone. To be a competent PvPer you really need to have the best of the best (or close to it), and as much life as at all possible. That's why such characters have only enough strength to wear the equipment that they have pre-planned since before creation.
 
Then you check out all of your gear, find the one with the lowest strength, equip it if you can, if you can't, add the necessary strength (and or dex) required to use it until you can. Then you see if that item gave you any stat bonuses and you equip your next highest requirement gear and you keep going until everything is equipped. (Often referred to as "glitching" as well and can give your character a naked look to other players)
Click to expand...

I believe you're wrong about the glitching. Glitching is when you don't have enough strength (or dex) to equip something with +str so you equip something else with +str, then wear the first item, and then you can take the other item off because the first item now provides the +str it needs to equip itself. The item works but others won't see you wearing it, and if you die you can't pick the item up unless there's room in your inventory because you don't have enough strength to wear the item without wearing the item.
 
Throttle said:
The "enough strength to wear equipment", as well as the "everything into vita" sentiments are usually only vital to PvP builds. People who write PvP guides generally assume that the reader knows what the best setups for most builds are, and such characters aren't played through the game the ordinary way - they're rushed through and leech off of speed-runs until they're level 60+ and can actually wear the final equipment. If you're not doing PvP then it's not super important to keep all stats besides vitality as close to base as possible, at least not when playing softcore.

If you can't afford top-end equipment for your character, bringing him into PvP isn't a great idea. You can do so of course, but you're not really gonna beat anyone. To be a competent PvPer you really need to have the best of the best (or close to it), and as much life as at all possible. That's why such characters have only enough strength to wear the equipment that they have pre-planned since before creation.
Click to expand...

Interesting thread :soapbox:

I to play SP only. Personally I don't like to use charms and such for stat boosting. So My Summoner looks like this.

Str: 110
Dex: 50
Vit: 50
Eng: 50

Then I dump everything into Dex/Vit at 3/2 or 2/3 depending on my blocking needs, which isn't much because if you are getting hit from behind your wall of meat shields your screwing up somewhere. :yikes:



 
Why don't you like to use charms for stat boosting? I'm letting my +life charms take up a lot of my inventory space; seems very useful to me and cuts way back on the stat points I would have to invest to get to the same place. I think like 25% of my life, at about 31, is in charms(haven't spent any points yet).
 
Throttle said:
I believe you're wrong about the glitching. Glitching is when you don't have enough strength (or dex) to equip something with +str so you equip something else with +str, then wear the first item, and then you can take the other item off because the first item now provides the +str it needs to equip itself. The item works but others won't see you wearing it, and if you die you can't pick the item up unless there's room in your inventory because you don't have enough strength to wear the item without wearing the item.
Click to expand...

That's a very bad way to do it though because if you die, you can't regain your body.

The good way to glitch is by doing what I wrote. For example, if you had a bowazon that needed 100 str to wear a bow (just an example), and you used torch/anni to get to 60, then you used Ik Belt to get 25 str (85), then used Guillaumes for another 15 str (100), then you'd get a naked glitch because you do not actually have the base strength to wear your bow (or armor).

But yeah, also many people will spend only 1-2 hours to get a character to level 80 by grushing so they don't usually care about remaking. At least I don't. It's when you get into the late 80's-90's that it's a real pain.



 
No, I'm pretty sure that doesn't glitch you. You only go "naked" when you're wearing an item which itself provides enough strength to meet its requirment. Such as putting on an Arreats so you can wear your Storm and then taking your Arreats off.

If you have a base strength of 60 and put on a pair of +40 strength gloves, wearing a req 100 armor does not glitch you. It'll be visible and work just as it should as long as you have at least 100 strength from other sources.

Otherwise every single PvP character would appear naked... I mean, who has enough base strength to wear all of their gear, really?
 
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