WW Ghost Assassin Guide V2.0

Re: WW Ghost Assassin Guide V2.0

Thanks for reply !
Now just a short question before I go to sleep, would save me some time that I would spend on calculation tomorrow. Do you know what fools+ed% value will beat fury in any way or is 24% overall ED too good ? (if you have highlords, its already 34% deadly strike, on fury claw would be 67 % deadly, so the multiplier rises from 1.34->1.67 which is 24 % increase in damage overall after all damage is calculated). I can do the math on it tomorrow, but it's better to ask first :)

And is knockback on fools (or some standard gosu fury substitute rare) a mod you really want (is it useful in any case you can remember, and does it change anything drastically), cause I have never tried it in duels. Can it be negative also, I would not like someone getting kicked out of my triWW by a knockback (if that can happen at all).

thanks !
 
Re: WW Ghost Assassin Guide V2.0

In order to "beat" it, it'll need 200+ ED, fools, 2soc, some base skills like venom or LS, 2x Um in the sockets, 40IAS.

KB can be good if you don't plan on triwhirling. That makes it very bad for a main claw, but it's good enough vs barbs and dins that it's used as a swap claw. KB can, and will KB out of a triwhirl, and 9 out of 10, they'll escape.
 
Re: WW Ghost Assassin Guide V2.0

Sass said:
In order to "beat" it, it'll need 200+ ED, fools, 2soc, some base skills like venom or LS, 2x Um in the sockets, 40IAS.

KB can be good if you don't plan on triwhirling. That makes it very bad for a main claw, but it's good enough vs barbs and dins that it's used as a swap claw. KB can, and will KB out of a triwhirl, and 9 out of 10, they'll escape.
Click to expand...

Naah it's a little bit different calculation. Ends up in calculating :
Wmax2 >= Alpha*Wmax1+maxdamage*(Alpha-1)
where Wmax 1 is the fury = 54(feral claw)*3.09 and Alpha being 1.24. When I drink my coffee I'm gonna plot this idea. So is fury with knockback vs hammers and barbs a winning idea ?


 
Re: WW Ghost Assassin Guide V2.0

Exact ED is going to change from that, but without a min of 200, Fury's better for damage. The other mods are required to match Fury in usability, not considering damage.

VS Hdins, I'd say no KB. It's good to mess them up a little, but I'd knock them into my line while moving away, so that didn't help, or I'd knock them to a side, and a hammer would just swirl and hit me eventually. Vs barbs, yes, it is a bit better. the dins I was thinking are foh and smiter.

In practicality, it's a neat mod, but not one needed, nor reliable.
 
Re: WW Ghost Assassin Guide V2.0

So approximately around 250ED+Fools max damage is enough to cover the damage of the fury. 200ed for max damage, around 250 for min, but that's not even calculating the AR bonus on chance to hit. So 250+ed/2soc/fools will beat fury always (except when having knockback on it, that sux balls for everything xcept hammers and baba right?)...bah I wanted to say something more but I forgot...might remember later

btw what resist is optimally ? I remember when duelling before publicly, that anya is one trick pony, stacking to 75 without her would be smart thing to do, but that puts me in position on having good res on ring + 5-6 SC life/@. thats 15-18max damage loss -.-
 
Re: WW Ghost Assassin Guide V2.0

lol, I'd said that it was good vs non hdin pallies and some barbs :P

@ res. A general rule of thumb is never rely on Anya's res boost (get them, never add them to any consideration). Another, have maxed res before you cast fade. Even swapping a few max charms won't hurt; ww sins are able to get away with that kind of swap since it'll help damage, but never really hurt it when it's gone. We're weird like that.
 
Re: WW Ghost Assassin Guide V2.0

Sass said:
lol, I'd said that it was good vs non hdin pallies and some barbs :P

@ res. A general rule of thumb is never rely on Anya's res boost (get them, never add them to any consideration). Another, have maxed res before you cast fade. Even swapping a few max charms won't hurt; ww sins are able to get away with that kind of swap since it'll help damage, but never really hurt it when it's gone. We're weird like that.
Click to expand...

But doesn't that require 175 resist ?! I can't get that high lol


 
Re: WW Ghost Assassin Guide V2.0

o.O

20 helm, 30+anni/torch, sockets (circ can get another 30), Amulet (high = 30, so + trangs' 30, effectively 30 all since fire and poison don't pierce like light and cold do).

So far uh...110 only 65? Ring can get ~10 ish (or high on one type), and boots can get upwards of 30-40 (for easy sake, howabout 20 depending on what you can find / get).

That's only 35 to go, and just for stacked without touching charms. An average fade would leave ~30 ish stacked, so not good vs -res chars, but certainly good for a general thing.

EDIT: And i forgot anya XD Still, it's only the once deal anyway, but at least gives max pre-fade ^_^
 
Re: WW Ghost Assassin Guide V2.0

Sass said:
o.O

20 helm, 30+anni/torch, sockets (circ can get another 30), Amulet (high = 30, so + trangs' 30, effectively 30 all since fire and poison don't pierce like light and cold do).

So far uh...110 only 65? Ring can get ~10 ish (or high on one type), and boots can get upwards of 30-40 (for easy sake, howabout 20 depending on what you can find / get).

That's only 35 to go, and just for stacked without touching charms. An average fade would leave ~30 ish stacked, so not good vs -res chars, but certainly good for a general thing.

EDIT: And i forgot anya XD Still, it's only the once deal anyway, but at least gives max pre-fade ^_^
Click to expand...

i have 3/20/2 helm with shael and 15ias/13 jewel...might socket shael 20/15 here (depends on claw and ias on it) , boots 30/10/40cold/25fire, anni torch 19/20 both...I don't know why I started to type this, but actually I forgot Trangs have 30 cold resist, so I wanna thank you for that mate, I though 20/poison on them was too good to have any other mods lol. Big miss see for me :D (I knew they had cold, but not in the last 10 days )


 
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Re: WW Ghost Assassin Guide V2.0

the fools vs fury question is pretty tough to calculate because:

1. its debatable whether the fools +AR carries over to the chaos claw (which deals most of the physical damage)
2. you need to incorporate the AR% and -def% from fury also
3. calculating the extra damage higher % hit is non-linear because venom and OW deal damage over time
4. chance to hit increase from adding fools AR will vary by the opponent. see chart below:
5. when the paladin is charging, its def will be 0, so the extra AR will not increase hit % then.

http://img10.imageshack.us/img10/9645/hitrate.png

AR/Def ratio is attacker's AR divided by defenders DR. i.e. 5000 AR vs 1000 Def = AR/Def of 5

plus, you can use eth-bugged fury claws :D


RE: resistances

just get 75 for all elements in hell. you shouldn't need to stack more than that for most duels, as you should be able to stuff most casters into a can without much problem. usually being able to survive one blizz hit (which can be done with just 75% res and a Rfrost) is enough to tackle the cold sorcs.

RE: deadly strike

HL + mastery is 1.5x damage multiplier. with fury, you max out your primary claw's chance for DS, meaning your multiplier is 2.0x. this means fury's 66% DS increases damage by 33%
 
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Re: WW Ghost Assassin Guide V2.0

One thing I've never understood was taking a DS' percent and calling it a damage increase of a measurable amount. Does this just refer to average damage over a set time?
 
Re: WW Ghost Assassin Guide V2.0

Sass said:
One thing I've never understood was taking a DS' percent and calling it a damage increase of a measurable amount. Does this just refer to average damage over a set time?
Click to expand...

the % chance to deal double damage can be interpreted as a damage multiplier.

algebra:

average damage = (%_normal x damage x 1) + (%_deadly x damage x 2)]
average damage = damage x [%_normal + (2 x %_deadly)]
average damage = damage x [%_normal + %_deadly + %_deadly]
%_normal + %_deadly = 1 <-- by definition
average damage = damage x (1 + %_deadly)
damage multiplier = 1 + %_deadly

so... 50% chance for DS means your average damage increases 50% (multiplier of 1.5)



 
Re: WW Ghost Assassin Guide V2.0

Eth bug is old and non ladder+in europe that stuff costs millions...deadly strike from hl+mastery =1.47, with fury ds = 1.8, which makes 1,22 multiplier difference...its 66OW, not deadly strike...

btw what's your personal opinion on knockback or you don't have it ? :)
 
Re: WW Ghost Assassin Guide V2.0

TienJe said:
the % chance to deal double damage can be interpreted as a damage multiplier.

algebra:

average damage = (%_normal x damage x 1) + (%_deadly x damage x 2)]
average damage = damage x [%_normal + (2 x %_deadly)]
average damage = damage x [%_normal + %_deadly + %_deadly]
%_normal + %_deadly = 1 <-- by definition
average damage = damage x (1 + %_deadly)
damage multiplier = 1 + %_deadly

so... 50% chance for DS means your average damage increases 50% (multiplier of 1.5)
Click to expand...
o.O Ok, that checks out assuming norm + deadly works like that, but could you explain it a little further? :scratchchin:

For instance, how that equation was made to find average :S


 
Re: WW Ghost Assassin Guide V2.0

monSin said:
Eth bug is old and non ladder+in europe that stuff costs millions...deadly strike from hl+mastery =1.47, with fury ds = 1.8, which makes 1,22 multiplier difference...its 66OW, not deadly strike...

btw what's your personal opinion on knockback or you don't have it ? :)
Click to expand...
whoops, its been a while since i've looked at a fury claw.

34% DS from HL, 23% CS from mastery, and 33% DS from fury give me 75% chance for double damage. without fury, thats 49% chance. still a 17% damage increase in damage for fury's 33% DS. that doesn't mean a 1.17 damage multiplier though, because fury's DS doesn't transfer to the chaos, and because fury's physical damage has quite a bit effect on its own.

i don't like kb personally, as i like to be able to stun continuously with DoD. i wouldnt mind it vs paladins and barbs, but its a waste of a mod.

finding a fools claw with proper IAS, 2soc, and cruel is probably harder than finding a eth bugged chaos. if you really want, you can always just go with non-bugged eth claws and replace them as you wear them down.



 
Re: WW Ghost Assassin Guide V2.0

Sass said:
o.O Ok, that checks out assuming norm + deadly works like that, but could you explain it a little further? :scratchchin:

For instance, how that equation was made to find average :S
Click to expand...

its just.. the average, assuming a denominator of 100%



 
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