Support unusual builds!
- Thread starter Cormallon
- Start date
You guys need to check out Lothrics builds. Here's a few of his 59 that I could dig up:
Daggerzon, Jacqueline, Lothric
Fire Trapper, Sekmet, Lothric
Firewall/Warcry Magebarb, Ishum, Lothric
Armageddon Bear, Hephaestus, Lothric
Fire Elemental, Horus, Lothric
Hungry Bear, Sioux, Lothric
Fury/Geddon, Ninurta, Lothric
Fire Claws/Rabies, Silver_Fang, Lothric
Skeletal Mage/Thrower, Sutekh, Lothric
Fire Ranger, Thraun, Lothric
Storm Ranger, William, Lothric
Martyr, Michael, Lothric
Holy Fire Zealot, Vulcan, Lothric
Battlemage, Selene, Lothric
Throw sorc, Magistra, Lothric
Vengeance Sorc, Morrigan, Lothric
Daggerzon, Jacqueline, Lothric
Fire Trapper, Sekmet, Lothric
Firewall/Warcry Magebarb, Ishum, Lothric
Armageddon Bear, Hephaestus, Lothric
Fire Elemental, Horus, Lothric
Hungry Bear, Sioux, Lothric
Fury/Geddon, Ninurta, Lothric
Fire Claws/Rabies, Silver_Fang, Lothric
Skeletal Mage/Thrower, Sutekh, Lothric
Fire Ranger, Thraun, Lothric
Storm Ranger, William, Lothric
Martyr, Michael, Lothric
Holy Fire Zealot, Vulcan, Lothric
Battlemage, Selene, Lothric
Throw sorc, Magistra, Lothric
Vengeance Sorc, Morrigan, Lothric
pancakeman
New member
I like the unusual build every now and then, but I sometimes get bored with the game so I love having my Zealot to butcher things with.
And I definitely agree, we should encourage newer people to try weird things. If someone says : Can I make a Zealot around the weapon _____, I say go for it! However, this doesn't me we should instill false hope, for example telling them that a Wirtadin will easily solo Hell Baal. Then again, I think they know what they are getting into, most of the time.
And I definitely agree, we should encourage newer people to try weird things. If someone says : Can I make a Zealot around the weapon _____, I say go for it! However, this doesn't me we should instill false hope, for example telling them that a Wirtadin will easily solo Hell Baal. Then again, I think they know what they are getting into, most of the time.
a very good idea. maybe there will be more attention to non-cookie-cutter builds. Personally I have 2 not very ordinary Mats - Enchant/Blizz sorc with Demonmachine and Dragon Claw/Tigerstrike assasin. The last one had a lot of comments with doubts in her effectiveness... I tried to make a light trapper, but I just got bored with her.:azn:
Now I'm working on full light Nova sorc with Insight. She's a fun. Hope, soon you'll see her as a Mat:smiley:
Now I'm working on full light Nova sorc with Insight. She's a fun. Hope, soon you'll see her as a Mat:smiley:
Mind sharing where this thread is located?
My Magi Barb build was created in apr 2005 so I was wondering when Lothric built his.
sirpoopsalot
New member
Martyrs pop up from time to time. Someone here in the SPF had a nice Patriarch writeup, but I'm not finding it in my search. Here's one from the Pally forum that isn't too bad (a little BNet-ish on the equipment though, and the formatting is p*ss-poor). I think you'll really, really need Life Leech.
http://www.purediablo.com/forums/showthread.php?t=563174&highlight=martyr
My thoughts exactly. Which is why I think yiuman deserves a cookie for the kind of advice he gave me here. :smiley:
For those that don't want to follow the linky: he commented on my ideas, and gave some advice on how to make them work. But he also provided me with another idea which might work better.
All of that together was exactly what I was looking for. And it's one of the reasons I prefer the SPF over most other dii.net forums.
Thanks for the kind words. I only post when I think that I have something useful to say. You might notice from my thread count that its a little on the low side for how long I've been registered.
On a different note, that thread has got me thinking about making a 'geddon bear myself.
All of my melee Amazons max Inner Sight. At high levels, it's more effective than Penetrate, and it also helps out your merc and partymates. The only really good argument against it is its low range, which makes it practically useless to bowies.
Anyway, as someone who makes a fair bit of ugly builds himself, I am very supportive when someone talks about a really off-the-wall build, even something that's generally underpowered, as long as it's a *VIABLE* and *SENSIBLE* build. For instance, if you build it right, a Holy Freeze Ranger might be very difficult and suboptimal, but it's still viable, and the basic idea behind it makes sense. A Sanctuary Ranger, on the other hand, simply isn't viable without some pretty extreme hoop-jumping. Meanwhile, a Frenzy/Whirlwind hybrid doesn't make much sense- one attack will become superior to the other, and you'll wind up using that attack 95% of the time with no logical reason to switch to the other. There really aren't any situations where Whirlwind shines and Frenzy doesn't, or where Frenzy shines and Whirlwind doesn't (as opposed to, say, Frenzy/Berserk, where Berserk fills the role of PI/IM solution).
When faced with what I deem to be a "non-viable and/or nonsensical build", I try to use a 3-step approach.
Step #1- Brutal honesty.
I start by trying to give a very realistic assessment of where this build is going to struggle... and most importantly, exactly *WHY* it will struggle at those points. Will it lack crowd control? Will it lack an immunity solution? Does it have no way to deal with IM? Does it prominently feature two attacks that are totally redundant (such as Double Swing + Frenzy) or two attacks that don't have logical situational uses (such as Whirlwind + Frenzy)? Or will it simply be so lacking in offense that simply beating Hell difficulty will be an extreme test of patience?
Step #2- Suggesting easier alternatives.
This is where I try to suggest similar builds that will hopefully maintain the general playstyle of the original build, but which won't face as many difficulties. For instance, if someone wants to build an Impaleazon, I might suggest a good Jabazon or Tankazon build instead. If someone wants to build a Double Swing/Leap Attack hybrid, I might suggest dropping the hybrid and just going Double Swing or Leap Attack.
Step #3- Optimization.
If the person is set on making their build anyway, I make suggestions to make it as good as humanly possible, and then I offer words of encouragement and emphasize that I very much hope that the person proves me wrong. This step is very big- while I believe firmly in ugly builds, I do not believe in making un-optimized builds. Once you decide what your idea of fun is, I firmly believe in creating the best character possible that conforms to that idea.
I'm quite pleased, the spirit seems still strong in the SPF :thumbsup:
There were a lot of good comments and suggestions, I hope these will make their way into toe regular build thread.
Of course we should point out where a specific idea will fail, and why. It's sometimes difficult to draw a line between 'underpowered' and 'not working at all' though.
Indeed. If in doubt, we should ask what he really wants, instead of just assuming something (most often the responses tend to well known power builds / easy builds).
And even more, when asking a question about builds, we all should state more clearly what we want, and what is already decided and what is open for discussion.
There were a lot of good comments and suggestions, I hope these will make their way into toe regular build thread.
Of course we should point out where a specific idea will fail, and why. It's sometimes difficult to draw a line between 'underpowered' and 'not working at all' though.
Luca said:
Indeed. If in doubt, we should ask what he really wants, instead of just assuming something (most often the responses tend to well known power builds / easy builds).
And even more, when asking a question about builds, we all should state more clearly what we want, and what is already decided and what is open for discussion.
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What I think is more is important (as mentioned before) is making the distinction with between 'underpowered' and 'unusual'. A blizzballer neglecting the fire tree in favor of ES is something else than a 2 handed enchantress.
True, true.
The funny part and for me also the motivation is to take the char that at the first glance looks underpowered and is unusual, to actually do some serious progress in the game. It's all about stylishness, even if it isn't a 2 handad enchantress. Even a FO/Fire Wall/SF - sorc is stylish in my eyes...
As most of us have ever enlarging ATMA stashes, having the 'optimum' equipment is not normally an issue.
For me, it is the marriage of skills and equipment that make the build. Un-orthodox skill plans are the more obvious departure from the norm. But if you look carefully at the equipment you have, careful selection can make for some interesting builds even with standard skill plans. Nightfish patted his WW barb with dual Fleshrippers. Clearly not conventional.
I like more unusual builds. I have played in a few MP games and it is always nice to get the "what build is that?" questions. I'd like to see a few more innovative Pat / Mat threads, they are always a good read.
Everyone still needs a Hammerdin. After all we all know cheese is bad for you, but it does taste good :grin:
For me, it is the marriage of skills and equipment that make the build. Un-orthodox skill plans are the more obvious departure from the norm. But if you look carefully at the equipment you have, careful selection can make for some interesting builds even with standard skill plans. Nightfish patted his WW barb with dual Fleshrippers. Clearly not conventional.
I like more unusual builds. I have played in a few MP games and it is always nice to get the "what build is that?" questions. I'd like to see a few more innovative Pat / Mat threads, they are always a good read.
Everyone still needs a Hammerdin. After all we all know cheese is bad for you, but it does taste good :grin:
QFT. Skills are indeed usually a good start if you're looking for an interesting build. But some of the most interesting things I've seen come from people who take an item and decide to build something, anything, around it.
That last bit also touches on one of the reasons why I don't do the RWM. Conviction stick? No friggin' way...
The only four characters I've ever taken to Pat/Mat have been built around Sets, two low level, one high level and one in-between (along the same vein as Cormallon's Set Sept :thumbsup
. To me, half of the fun is trying to get the most out of an underpowered build. The only character with a high level set (Trang-Oul's) was not as much fun as the game was a bit too easy. (Good Pindle runner though.) Head Jumper
New member
Thanks alot! I was asure that my post has been dumped:largesad:
But this killed my motivation :astonished:
nvm, i will try to at least get a martyr pat..
pancakeman
New member
I couldn't agree more with SSoG. There is a huge difference between suggesting an item or skill that will help, and saying "You would be better with a hammerdin".
When I did my build, I got some good support, though not to much of it.
When I did my build, I got some good support, though not to much of it.