Dual Crescent Moon - Viable for Frenzybarb?

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Mordach

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Dual Crescent Moon - Viable for Frenzybarb?

The thread title basically says it all. A few minutes ago, I came to think about this... A Frenzybarb dual-wielding a pair of Crescent Moons, packing a whole bunch of Lightning damage small charms. Would this be viable or even useful?

(If you can't be bothered with all the numbers, skip the first part and read the part after the ----- line.)

First, let's take a look at the stats:

Crescent Moon
10% Chance To Cast Level 17 Chain Lightning On Striking
7% Chance To Cast Level 13 Static Field On Striking
+20% Increased Attack Speed
+180-220% Enhanced Damage (varies)
Ignore Target's Defense
-35% To Enemy Lightning Resistance
25% Chance of Open Wounds
+9-11 Magic Absorb (varies)
+2 To Mana After Each Kill
Level 18 Summon Spirit Wolf (30 Charges)

1) This gives for some interesting combinations. With the high attack speed of a Frenzybarb, coupled with the 40% IAS from CM x2, the Static Field (and puny Chain Lightning) will trigger quite often. What we're actually looking at is 20% ctc CL, and 14% ctc SF per Frenzy double-swing.

2) As long as there are enemies within range we'll basically hit almost always, (95%?) seeing as both our swords Ignore Target's Defense. This also means we won't have to worry about AR.

3) The %ED isn't too high on CM, but in a Berzerker Axe, we're looking at (68-80) - (199-228). Let's assume we got an average 200% ED. This is 72-213. Not too much, but it's not too shabby either. We could also go crazy and put CM in a pair of Phase Blades. This'll do wonders for your attack speed, but decrease your physical damage to ~100 average damage.

4) We've got 25% OW x2. If I'm not completely mistaken, this equals 50% OW per Frenzy double-swing. This'll add some nice bleeding on our enemies. With Dracul's Grasp (25% OW) and Gore Riders (10% OW) we're at 85% OW...?

5) We've got 18-22 Magic Absorb. In PvM this won't come into play very often, but it's nice to have. There's also the +4 to Mana After Each Kill, and 60 charges of Spirit Wolf. Not really necessary, but nice to have too.

Now, here comes the fun part:
6) -70% To Enemy Lightning Resist. Each sword's got -35% to ELR, and if we add this up we've got a total of -70%. This is our main strength. This will nicely negate as good as all of the Lightning Resist on every monster in the game, save Lightning Immunes. (What this does to LI's, I'm not sure but perhaps some of the gurus have an answer.)
With a stash filled with Lightning damage Small Charms, we can really start to have some fun. Let's take a look at some numbers again:

Let's assume we have 16 Shocking Small Charms at an average of 1-60 Lightning damage each. This gives us 16-960 Lightning damage per hit. But wait! We've got -70% to ELR, which means that against a monster with no Lightning Resist, we'll do 28-1632 LDamage per hit, which means double that per Frenzy Double-swing.

Oh, and don't forget the Static Field that ~always will do it's full damage, and the CL that will hit up to 8 enemies at 1-400 LDamage per hit. Not game-ending, but it'll help.

If we're a rich RWM player, we could wield a Dream helm (yeah right). With another 1-648 Lightning Damage added per attack we're up to 29-2734 Lightning against monsters with no LightRes.



----------------------------------------------------------------------------------




So, what conclusion should we draw regarding this setup? Coupled with perhaps a Treachery armor we've got a potential fun character at our hands. Perhaps not the most efficient, but not completely lost behind a wagon neither. Certainly different than the average Frenzybarb too!

Let's add the 16 SC's, Treachery, Drac's Grasp and Gore Riders and sum it up.

Per double swing:
95% IAS
85% OW
Ignore Target's Defense
-70% to Enemy Lightning Resist
20% ctc lvl 17 CL on striking
14% ctc lvl 13 SF on striking
610-650 Poison damage over 0.4 seconds
56-3264 Lightning Damage

(Yeah, I know it's kinda unusual to measure it in double swings, but that's what you get for pressing that mouse button once.)

And then there's the CB and DS from Drac's and Gores. With perhaps Guillaume's Face and max mastery we've got about 50% CB and 50% DS per hit. Also with Treachery, when Fade triggers you'll have an additional 60% res all and 15% phys res. Also with Guillaume's we've got a total of 50% FHR.

Now, lemme get some feedback on this. Would it be a different approach on the Frenzy/Double Swing barb? Definately. Would it be fun to play? I should think so. Would it work well in Hell? I don't know. What do you think?

-Mordach-
 
Very interesting Mordach (I enjoy reading your ideas :smiley: ), however I think the lack of physical damage when compared to other alternative frenzy weapons is not made up for by the added lightning damage which is only moderately impressive imo. And that's assuming you can get your hands on 16 shocking charms :wink3: . Still, sounds like it could be a load of fun.

-PP

ps - first!
 
% to cast spells dont stack, it will remain at 7% per strike. Seems like an interesting idea, I would aim for faster weapons over higher physical damage since most of the damage will be elemental anyway. Faster weapon also means more chances to release static field/chain lightning.
 
The IAS from your weapons don't stack, and in the case of frenzy the IAS on your second weapon literally does nothing. ITD doesn't work on champions or bosses, so you're going to need high AR anyways. Good luck getting 16 SC's each doing 1-60 lightning damage too.

Other than that it's perfectly viable, just don't expect it to mow through p8 Hell.

Oh, and for the record, Mordach's CtC numbers are right (i.e. for every 100 double swings you'll cast static 14 times with dual Crescent Moons).
 
Well, the static field and itd surely make it a viable weapon, but... the -%LR doesn't add up to 70. It's counted seperately for each hit... :sad2:
 
Ah well, thanks for the feedback guys! :thumbsup

poopie_pants said:
Very interesting Mordach (I enjoy reading your ideas ), however I think the lack of physical damage when compared to other alternative frenzy weapons is not made up for by the added lightning damage which is only moderately impressive imo. And that's assuming you can get your hands on 16 shocking charms . Still, sounds like it could be a load of fun.
Click to expand...
Thanks! I'm glad it's entertaining, even though my ideas don't always work. The charms part is the hard part.. :/

AeroGear said:
% to cast spells dont stack, it will remain at 7% per strike. Seems like an interesting idea, I would aim for faster weapons over higher physical damage since most of the damage will be elemental anyway. Faster weapon also means more chances to release static field/chain lightning.
Click to expand...
I know, but 7% x2 hits = 14% per double swing in theory. :D

kabal said:
Other than that it's perfectly viable, just don't expect it to mow through p8 Hell.
Click to expand...
I don't. :P

Reborn2k said:
Well, the static field and itd surely make it a viable weapon, but... the -%LR doesn't add up to 70. It's counted seperately for each hit...
Click to expand...
It's a shame that the -res don't stack! It could be an interesting thing if it did. :(

How about one CM and one weapon with high LDamage? Ah well, at least I had fun coming up with the idea even though it's not an uber setup. I enjoy trying to come up with interesting and different gear setups and builds! :prop:
 
Since the -ELR doesn't stack, why don't you put a Gimmershred in the other hand? That's 29-501 lightning damage. Or a lightsabre for dual PB cool points. Or a 6os PB socketed with 6 jools of thunder.

You wouldn't get as much out of a CM Phase Blade as a Tesladin would, but don't forget the coolness factor. My cool-o-meter goes *beep* right now.

Edit: That's three times I said cool in this post. It is getting cold in here...
 
I say no to the Gimmershred because there's no mastery for it when used in melee. Lightsabre would work best with a CM phase blade since you don't have to get two different masteries (plus PB's look cool like AJK said while berserker axes look like toys).
 
Added to that I think that the -%LR only works on the CM PB itself and only in the moment while you are attacking.
 
Reborn2k said:
Added to that I think that the -%LR only works on the CM PB itself and only in the moment while you are attacking.
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I'm not sure of that. I mean, I use a CMPB on my lightsorc and never (well sometimes for giggles) hit stuff directly with it. My spells do notice the difference.

kabal, ah masteries. Forgot about those. I'm still a nub when it comes to barbs.
 
Single handed axes have to be the dumbest weapon in game, damage is fine but durability is way too low, they always end up broken so the only good 1h axes are the indestructible runewords...

And like you mention, berserker/naga/war axe has a crappy look.
 
AJK said:
I'm not sure of that. I mean, I use a CMPB on my lightsorc and never (well sometimes for giggles) hit stuff directly with it. My spells do notice the difference.
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I'm not 100% sure, but I think it's like that. At least it just works for the attacker, so it doesn't affect a lightning sorc's lightning skills, if a merc wears a CM weapon.
 
CM's main weakness is that its main attack, SF, cuts out at 50% life... so why would you want two? You need to find something that would take over once SF stops working, not something that would cut out at the same time. I'd look for another sword that did a different damage type, or simply a lot of physical damage. There are probably rares out there that would beat the beegeebers out of the uniques.
 
Pretty sure the -ELR% works cumulatively regardless of the source, whether it's from facets, Griffon's eye or dual-wielded CMs.

As for the "downside" of static cutting out at 50% of enemy life, that applies regardless of psetting and would be similar to (but not quite the same as) doubling your base damage (against non-LIs). The trick is to make certain that the base damage is worth "doubling".

Legend swords might be good. More damage than a phase blade, more durability than a 1h axe and they look fairly cool (axes definitely blow for dur and appearance one-handed).
 
kabal said:
(plus PB's look cool like AJK said while berserker axes look like toys).
Click to expand...

Wha? me like killing stuff with toothpicks :badteeth:

So weapon under glows(?) is you primary and that means you dont need great ias on second one coz it doesnt matter when using frenzy? am I correct?:cool:
 
I've actually tried this setup once. I Patted a frenzy barb with dual Lightsabres, then went back through A5 with dual CM PBs, all on /p1. It took a while and a little bit of running away, but beating the game with the Lightsabres was certainly do-able. I lost patience with the CMs, tho.

What I found that worked best was to use one of each, or to switch between both weapon sets. The numbers still aren't that impressive, but it works. Kinda. It's true, ITD is useless against the toughest monsters in the game, so it was often difficult to score hits. Adding Enchant helps, but if your AR isn't high enough it doesn't really matter anyway.

If you've got the runes to sink into it, try it... but I'd suggest finding a second weapon instead of wielding dual.
 
I recommend phase blades for the two plusses they get: speed and durability. I hate slow attacks and I really hate repairing stuff twice every area.
 
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