Disappearing runes.

[solutionx]

Disappearing runes.

I can't say I'm pissed, but I will admit I'm a bit saddened to see a high rune *POOF* out of my bank for the second time this week alone. Are there really that many duped runes around? I traded legit items for bugged runes twice now, and I created an Enigma made with traded runes, so I have no idea if they were duped as well.

How do you guys get around this? Is it really so hard for blizzard to eliminate duping bugs? Heck, should I just conduct all of my high-end trades here from now on, since people are more likely to be trusted?

At this rate, I probably wont ever have the HRs needed to make more runewords unless I find the runes myself. Maybe it's just something that occurs often on west, or maybe I'm just very unlucky.

 

[TurbulentTurtle]

Re: Disappearing runes.

Runes are duped in every realm. Some say that well over 90% of the high runes you see in the realms are duped, which isn't really surprising. Have you taken a look at the odds of finding an actual Zod rune? And yet we see BOTDs left and right.

 

[aishilee]

Re: Disappearing runes.

The Way to get around this is to

1) keep your high runes in storage characters ( or characters that rarely you log into)
2) immediately socket/use the runes
3) immediately trade away the runes
4) Trade for HR when you actually need the HR.

 

[Thyiad1]

Re: Disappearing runes.

aishilee is incorrect.

The way around it is to find the rune yourself. Anything else presumes you don't mind using a duped rune.

 

[solutionx]

Re: Disappearing runes.

Well since apparently no one "minds using a duped rune" there should be some kind of warning stickied to the newcomer forum, because I at least had no idea it was this common. Pretty sad, actually.

I can't believe this has yet to be resolved by blizzard. It should have been their first priority when patching the game in the past.

 

[Thyiad1]

Re: Disappearing runes.

Do you mean like this sticky?

Similar posted in the Trade Forums.

 

[solutionx]

Re: Disappearing runes.

the only relation there are the words "duped" and "runes." I saw that sticky, but I still had no idea it was a problem of this scale on bnet. It doesn't really matter anymore to me after reading the replies on this thread, but other new players should know from the get-go.

 

[Alecz]

Re: Disappearing runes.

I think I know what solutionx means.

What should be done to prevent people from getting ripped off and also to discourage duping is to post a sort of warning on the trading forums.

For old gamers it is common knowledge that high runes are duped by default, and they poof. However some people learn this the hard way! They work hard on countess runs and get several mid runes, then trade them for a ber that poofs. This isn't fair! I did mention this in one thread but most people won't read it.

Just a simple trading warning should suffice:

"Be aware that 99.9% of high runes are dupes, and are subject to poofing! When you trade for a HR with someone you don't trust you should assume the risks that the rune will poof.
"

And then provide a list of commonly duped runes. This list should be periodically updated by a moderator, and everyone would be safer. For example, a guy gave a Vex for free... just gave to me in a public game. Now I know vex is findable (Forge, countess), but I still think its a common dupe (correct me if I'm wrong).

In my eyes this rune is worth up to a legit Pul... I would only trade this for another legit Rune, or see what happens (i don't really care if it poofs).

But some people trade their hard earned stuff for dupes and learn it the hard way, IT'S NOT FAIR! Just make a sticky to warn ppl, it easy and helpful.

To summarize: People are still surprized high runes / godly item poof - we know that, we should warn them!

 

[lionheartthebrave]

Re: Disappearing runes.

@Alecz: Vex can't drop from the HF, and the countess drops them very rarely, so it probably was a dupe

If you hate duping, start playing single player/self found, the SPF is very friendly, just don't expect to make enigma/BoTD/infinity

 

[Thyiad1]

Re: Disappearing runes.

And then provide a list of commonly duped runes. This list should be periodically updated by a moderator, and everyone would be safer.

No.

Personal responsibility. You are the trader it is YOUR responsibility to make investigations and research regarding your trading partners. A lot of effort already goes into this site to keep it free of scammers - as much as is practical. But people are greedy and dupe their soulstone if they thought it would get them a pgem.

In my eyes this rune is worth up to a legit Pul... I would only trade this for another legit Rune, or see what happens (i don't really care if it poofs).

If you posted that on any forum on this site you'd be banned on sight. We don't condone duping and aren't going to say "yeah this is duped, go trade for it". Unfortunately it is a fact that duping exists. It's that simple.

To summarize: People are still surprized high runes / godly item poof - we know that, we should warn them!

Why can't traders read and lurk before jumping into trading? Hmm?
We have a New Traders Probationary Period in the SPF. 15 trades and three months history in the SPF before being allowed to trade certain items. Perhaps you'd like that on the Realms? But as you trade more frequently there, perhaps it should be fifty trades and six months? No because it would 'inconvenience' you. You can't have it both ways.

Just try being sensible. That's all it takes.

 

[krischan]

Re: Disappearing runes.

And then provide a list of commonly duped runes. This list should be periodically updated by a moderator, and everyone would be safer. For example, a guy gave a Vex for free... just gave to me in a public game. Now I know vex is findable (Forge, countess), but I still think its a common dupe (correct me if I'm wrong).

OK, done. Here's the bnet Europe list: 99% of Ohm+ and 50% of Vex are duped :tongue:

Since 1.10, the Countess has a maximum of Ist for her special drop. The Hellforge reward produces runes up to Gul since then, but it makes sense (on ladder) to cube up two of them to Vex, of course.

 

[Alecz]

Re: Disappearing runes.

To lionheartthebrave:

My only problem with single player is that there is no Uber Trist and no Diablo Clone (not that the latter is common on Bnet...). Also some of the runewords that are very useful and relatively easy to make are unavailable (Insight). I am not very inclined to use mods either. I know some of the advantages: unlimited chars, easy muling with atma, very friendly community, etc.

As for Enigma, Infinity, and BotD... I'm not that fond of them, and I don't plan to make them on ladder, even if I do find the runes.


To Thyiad:

- I understand that it's not easy to keep the site free of scammers, or to enforce all your policies. For example it is this forum where I learned alot about perming, even though those threads were supposed to be deleted... I am just surprised that ppl don't know that high runes and uber uniques are dupped. I mean a new guy that just starts will probably do no research, and will probably have no idea that dupping is happening in this game to such an extent. If this forum does not allow perming methods, why are so many threads saying how to deal with the problems?

- I know very well the policy on trading on this forum. I don't intend to trade the Vex here if at all. So you don't have to ban me:thumbsup:.

- I didn't mean to make that probation thing for the realms, just let people know that some items are commonly duped.


To krischan:

I really like your answer! I find your statistics really helpful!
At least this way I know not to trade my legit Ist for a Lo in a random trade game. But I could trade my legit Um for a Pul.

 

[Dorfoumous]

Re: Disappearing runes.

The question that never gets brought up..

Why doesn't blizz just increase the drop rates by like 500%?

I mean..its kinda retarded that you need AT LEAST 300% MF to get a small little chance of getting something good...not to mention Runes aren't affected by MF..

Your chances of finding a Zod are about the same as winning the lottery.


Not to mention, I would say that 99% of all HR's are duped...

Increase the drop rates, then MAYBE you'll get rid of the dupers because well there won't be a demand for them..

 

[Evrae Altana]

Re: Disappearing runes.

The question that never gets brought up..

Why doesn't blizz just increase the drop rates by like 500%?

It's been brought up god knows how many times.

not to mention Runes that are affected by MF..

Rune drops are not affected my MF.

 

[Thyiad1]

Re: Disappearing runes.

- I understand that it's not easy to keep the site free of scammers, or to enforce all your policies. For example it is this forum where I learned alot about perming, even though those threads were supposed to be deleted... I am just surprised that ppl don't know that high runes and uber uniques are dupped.

Actually I'd say this site is cleaner than almost any other site. Why? Because the Mods work hard to make it so. We don't nanny around, we ban people we catch doing something hooky.

You'd be amazed how many people do something as silly as frequently bump that gets them a ban. If they can't be bothered to read the rules they aren't going to stick around long enough to do any other damage.

I mean a new guy that just starts will probably do no research,

Whose fault is that?

Why can't a new guy use common sense. If a deal is too good to be true then it is.

and will probably have no idea that dupping is happening in this game to such an extent. If this forum does not allow perming methods, why are so many threads saying how to deal with the problems?

Link five then if there's so many.

I'm getting the feeling you think this site is full of scammers. That isn't true. If you believe that then check out other forums. Anyone which uses FG for a start. See how fast you lose your stuff there. :wave:

 

[Alecz]

Re: Disappearing runes.

Sorry, I didn't mean to say that this forum is full of scammers and such, but I remember a thread about perming runes, where I made a comment that duping is bad, and got deleted of course for the reason that the thread was about perming runes, not ethics!

I found that thread by mistake a couple weeks ago, and I really don't see how that is complying with the forum rules, but maybe it's just me. Maybe I just saw beyond the innocence of the thread.

Anyhow I'd have to really look for it to find it.

As far as the new player, it's sort of catch-22. If he never visits a forum that warns him about dupes then he'll never know. A deal can also look fair and be a scam, but how would a new player know about drop rates, and values. When they see tal's and ral's all day, then they are offered a Pul or something for a hard earned Shako, it seems reasonable, but the Pul poofs.

It's actually blizzard's fault because they should warn the players. But they won't do it.

Another thing is the strategy guides on this forum. They suggest enigma's and Infinity's like they are very common, when every knowledgeable player knows they're dupes.

This is how I learned about the dupes: look for guides -> see the item section, -> check the runes -> notice I don't have them -> look for trades -> learn some poof ->wonder why -> learn about duping.

Also one day I had big lag in a game, and someone suggested it was because of duppers. Another person said "**** dupers, even if I don't know what they are and what they do!"

Until then... we're gonna see more threads about ppl complaining their runes poofed. Then some one is gonna make a "short guide" about trading.

 

[solutionx]

Re: Disappearing runes.

Why can't a new guy use common sense. If a deal is too good to be true then it is.

How is a new guy supposed to know the true value of a rune which is 99% likely duped? Heck, I'm surprised they have any value at all. But that's the thing, no one conducts miracle trades. I've yet to see a deal that's "too good to be true" but I feel like I've been scammed nonetheless.

Inform newcomers, don't simply assume they have no common sense.

 

[Thyiad1]

Re: Disappearing runes.

Why must every trader presume that it is our job to babysit them rather than THEIRS to take some personal responsibility?

Tell you what, lets take this premise elsewhere ... Let's have dedicated people available to everyone to help them across the road. Then they won't have to look.

Seriously, if you read around you'll understand values and availability. If you play for three weeks and don't find anything over an Amn and someone offers you six Chams for a pgems ... well, d'oh.

It's laziness people. Get game, go trade. No thought. No responsibility. No common sense. And I stand by that. Want to know why? Because I do my homework and see how dumb - I won't apologize for that word - traders can be.

 

[canudig]

Re: Disappearing runes.

How is a new guy supposed to know the true value of a rune which is 99% likely duped? Heck, I'm surprised they have any value at all. But that's the thing, no one conducts miracle trades. I've yet to see a deal that's "too good to be true" but I feel like I've been scammed nonetheless.

Inform newcomers, don't simply assume they have no common sense.

They don't in my eyes which is why I never have any on me unless I am going to make a specific runeword, and even then I plug it in ASAP.....

 

[solutionx]

Re: Disappearing runes.

I don't think you even read my reply. You're still responding to someone else. I'm not asking for babysitting, I'm *suggesting* others have the chance to know "runes are almost all duped" before they get into HR trading. It's as simple as that.

Do I have to go over it again? Steelrends for a Lo, Gores for a Vex; both near perfect. These are trades which were not in my favor considering normal USWest ladder pricing and the fact that they were near perfect. I just had no idea how little in my favor these trades were. Others should have the chance to know before they get into fair trading.

This has nothing to do with responsibility. If I had no responsibility I wouldn't have joiend Diabloii.net's forums before getting into multiplayer. I've found a Vex myself in the pits, so don't tell me I should have had common sense and known runes were all duped when there's the illusion that they are just rare enough with high, actual value.