I was hoping, I could avoid getting dragged into this. It doesn't get more meaningless than this.Note:My arguments are directed at your claims regarding range only,I can't muster the interest to look into your other 'findings'
-but, it BUGS me, when anyone tries to complicate things which are rather simple. That too without any viable purpose or benefit. Come on, is it that hard to find a ww wep that hits the final bp and has decent range, with all those runewords, rares & upgradeable uniques.
-If u are trying to propogate the usage of higher dmg weps that fall short in the range & bp criteria ,like the thunder maul in tele ww against casters, since according to you wep range & bp won't matter in the initial few frames in which the target is in range, SO how do u plan to fill in the gaps like resists, more mana for tele & ww, fcr-all provided by the like of wizzy or hoto? Most will agree that a botd/fury along with a wizzy/hoto is by far the best setup against casters, u will lack staying power otherwise.
RE:
Your first test…
mcm
The first test of range resulted in the same proximity being required to hit with ww for either weapon setup (dual range 1 or two handed range 5.) [B said:
What's more, ending a WW at a point where a hit was made with the range 1 weapons, then attempting to shift-attack resulted in no hit[/B], in fact, if I tried to attack from that range where WW was successful, the offensive character walked quite far towards the meat bag to strike, confirming that weapon range has no effect on WW range. As has been suggested before, weapon range only seems to effect a maximum number of hits possible on a stationary target with a single WW pass (I believe the number is weapon_range + 3.)
My arguments.
1.You were using a range 1 wep, that means the target will enter late and exit early from ur range, and ur movement speed will take u away too quickly from the target that was in range a millisec ago, meaning even the slightest delay in 'ending' a ww after the last hit is made will take u out of range, and u will never land a hit with any shift attack, not to mention the fact that u have to predetermined with ww on were u'd stop.
2. How sure are u that u 'ended' the ww at 'the point' u landed the last hit? Do u even have the means to do that? ww is a pred. attack, so are u accurately guessing and clicking at the point where u think u will land the last hit?
Any average player should tell, that the conditions of this test are scratchy, the results of which cannot be established as facts.
You 'refactored' your test after someone questioned the logics of the test.
Your 2nd test
mcm said:
I refactored my test for this by using the weapon of specific range to normal attack from a distance first, stopping where the attack took place, then trying to whirl away or perpendicular to the target vector. The test of significance is where the normal attack is made with a range 5 weapon, getting into range 5, then switching to range one and doing the WW. Indeed it appears there is a difference between the weapons with respect to range as WW away never hit from range 5 with the range 1 weapon, and the range 5 weapon occasionally did. However ww perpendicular to the target vector with the range 1 weapon from range 5 did occasionally hit. There seems to be very little difference with respect to range and the proximity required to hit with WW, I believe what led me to think that range did not matter was that I originally did this test with a range 3 vs 5 weapon and the difference is so small I would almost call it insignificant.
My arguments:
-There is nothing wrong with the conditions of this test,in fact I cant think of a better way to test whether wep range does matter in ww. The problem lies in the way you interpreted the results of the test.
-The result contradicted yr initial claims in the first test,and instead of acknowledging and reestablishing the fact that wep range does infact matter,u slapped on a condition to yr claim 'wep range matters when whirling away from the target'
- Then comes yr second claim with 2 conditions slapped,which further complicates the issue.
'1) Weapon range appears only to affect maximum hits possible on a stationary target.'
Why only 'stationary'? Why only ' a target'? Is it because ur tests were based on those conditions? One can interpret:
- A longer range wep will get equal number of hits to a shorter range waapon against mobile and/or multiple targets.
Your claims go against the widely established/proven/accepted concensus which I'd some up in a few phrases:
- Longer range weapons will have more targets in range and for a longer time than short range weapons,whether mobile or stationary.(this goes for pvp too,since even single targets will be in range for a longer time) even if it is marginal,like u are saying, and that is just the thing which makes a huge differnce in pvp: marginal advantage.period.
