Build Concpet: Heretic

M

mrbadexample

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Build Concpet: Heretic

Here is another build concept I thought up. Please tell me if I've stolen someone's idea. These builds I've though up are things I've researched in history . I just don't want to step on someone else's "soap-box" when I talk about these idea's. Ok enough banter here is my concept. Please also disreguard my spelling.

What is a Heretic?
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When a Paladin decided to drop his faith in his god and take up a new god or faith he is quickly excommunicated from his church. He still has is strength and convictions while taking up a new path a new faith. Believing in his cause he scours the land searching for support and troops. Many times the feriousity of his strength or the temperment of his faith make former foe's his friends and commrades in arms. His mear presence invokes power and strength. Those who do not follow in his path are soon crushed beneth his war machine.

Excited yet?

Build points
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Ok from what you read above I hope you get an idea what this paladin is about. If not then lete me put it out. A Heretic is a paladin who uses conversion/smite with supporting aura's of Fanatism or Conviction.

There are 2 main styles one for Fanatism and one for Conviction. Otherwise it is pretty much the same build. Here are the break downs.

Fanatic Heretic
20- Conversion (Main Attack)
20- Smite (Secondary Attack)
20- Holy Shield (Many reasons for this)
20- Fantasim (Main Aura)
1- Redemption/Meditation (always useful)


Condemning Heretic
20- Conversion (Main Attack)
20- Smite (Secondary Attack)
20- Holy Shield (Many reasons for this)
20- Conviction (Main Aura)
1- Redemption/Meditation (always useful)

Play Style
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The Heretic is played like any other melee paladin, but with a interesting twist. With maxed Conversion you'll get a new follower half the time for 16 seconds. During which they are enhanced by your aura and crush enemy's by your side. The maxed holy shield and smite aid in giving you a huge amount of defence as well as stuning larger monsters that gice you a hard time.

The Heretic must always be aware that many times there mat be decention in his ranks (i.e. Conversion wears off) so the aura from the Heretic may linger on his former followers. His huge defence and smite skill will protect him.

Wrap Up
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So that in a nut shell is my Heretic concept. Keep in mind this is a concept and not actually something I've played to the end of the skill plan, so this maybe an awesome build or it could suck bog water. Please let me know what you all think.
 
Conviction version is absolute junk, period.

The Fanatic version is just a PvM Smiter with Conversion maxed too instead of the Defiance synergy. I think it would be most effective to have just a normal PvM smiter, with a lone point in conversion to help out sometimes.

That said, I actually do like the idea of making a Smite/Converter, rather much so. The problem with Conversion is you need a backup skill against bosses. Smite = teh boss killar. Conversion doesn't really have any skills that iad it directly, so you may as well enhance your Smiting capabilites and get giant defense to keep you alive whilst converting. It is a VERY nice coincidence that neither Smite or Conversion require any AR. This build would be a superior PvM v/t as such...

Like I said, I like the idea if only for the wanton for my old Missionary to exist. I'll sleep on the idea and get back to you.
 
Why do you max Conviction for the 'Condeming Heretic' Doesnt seem like your gonna do a lot of elemental dmg or use Vengence.
 
RetroStar said:
Why do you max Conviction for the 'Condeming Heretic' Doesnt seem like your gonna do a lot of elemental dmg or use Vengence.
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Conviction shreds there physical defence as well.

90% at Slvl 20

Besides like someone else said. If I'm converting things left and right, I'll have elemental dmage provide for me from the heretics followers
 
mrbadexample said:
Conviction shreds there physical defence as well.

90% at Slvl 20

Besides like someone else said. If I'm converting things left and right, I'll have elemental dmage provide for me from the heretics followers
Click to expand...

Every conversion attack attempts to convert, independent from the chance to hit. So Defense reduction of Conviction does not matter.
 
mrbadexample said:
Conviction shreds there physical defence as well.

90% at Slvl 20

Besides like someone else said. If I'm converting things left and right, I'll have elemental dmage provide for me from the heretics followers
Click to expand...

A) Lower defense is a bad thing, that means you hit your soon-to-be-teammates. You don't need to hit with Conversion to convert.

B) That's just idiotic. You would use Conviction with Smite over Fanatisicm with Smite becuase on some rare occasions your teammates that don't do all that much anyway may be doing elemental damage??? Fanat+Smite = Dead Target. It just can't take crowds to easily, which is why Conversion is nice.

Like I said I'm goin to sleep, get back to you on gear n such later. Still liking the idea for a fun PvM build. 'Missionary2004/05'.
 
unfortuantely you will most likely kill the "followers" anyway. conversion doesn't last forever so eventually they will turn on you and you will kill them. That's just the way it is. Conviction will help ONLY your followers. Smite is ITD so the defense reduction is meaningless for you. and unless you are planning on stacking elemental damage somehow it would be completely wasted. I don't know if elemental damage transfers to a smite attack, but i have a feeling that it doesn't unless directly added to the weapon.

I think you would be better of maxing your damage/defense capabilities instead of going with conviction, but then it probably wouldn't be as much fun.
 
Vesio said:
unfortuantely you will most likely kill the "followers" anyway. conversion doesn't last forever so eventually they will turn on you and you will kill them. That's just the way it is. Conviction will help ONLY your followers. Smite is ITD so the defense reduction is meaningless for you. and unless you are planning on stacking elemental damage somehow it would be completely wasted. I don't know if elemental damage transfers to a smite attack, but i have a feeling that it doesn't unless directly added to the weapon.

I think you would be better of maxing your damage/defense capabilities instead of going with conviction, but then it probably wouldn't be as much fun.
Click to expand...

To my knowledge Fanatasim last longer on a monster so having a half dozen follows suddenly turn on me is not my idea of a good time. With conviction the damage reduction is meaning less for me I know that, but it will do wonders for my party and followers.

But like I said above this is only on paper, and I haven't got my that character up that high yet. I named him "Corvus" after the person you play in the original Heretic game.
 
The only issue I have is the following. Though having not used conversion I am curious about this:

Your attack has potential to convert a foe into an ally for a short period of time. At this point your main attack aura will be granted to the new ally (Fanaticism). When the effect of Conversion wear off, will the former ally still have the aura on them.

The reason I ask is this tends to happen with opponents that have been Mind Blasted and granted an offensive aura by a paladin. This is problematic when the effect wears off and they begin to attack you with the aura still in effect.

I do not know if this happens with Conversion...may want to check it out.
 
Delirium might not be a bad choice for this char, plus it would fit into the theme. The Heretic's armies are swell during the confusion and chaos of battle, as weak souls fall under his dark influence.
 
i know that the aura would still effect the monster in 09 for just a little bit before the next aura check went and that sucked. however in 1.10 i don't know if it happens that way. Since you can't stack auras like you could in 09 it would make sense that this problem was fixed to but then it may not have been.
 
lol tor u saw heritic and thought it was your guide for a defient smiter.. cant wait to make one. im getting a pally leveled just so i can amke one.
 
When a monster is converted it recieves your aura. When the conversion wears off they do still keep it for a reasonably short amount of time.

On the note of Conviction again;
Elemental damage does NOT work with smite at all and hence is of absoluty 0 help to you. Using this just to aid your 'teammates' is for lack of a softer word, idiotic. If the only reason you wish to use this over Fanaticism is because you are afraid of your 'betrayers' being Fanatic for a few secs, then use either Defiance as your main aura to keep you alive better, or Thorns and just don't smite them whilst they have the aura on but rather keep attempting to re-convert. Either of these is 900000% better than Conviction for this build. If you really want to use Conviction to aid your party just go make an Avenger.

Gear-wise I was thinking these looked nice;
Guilleame's/CoA
Mara's
Kingslayer Phaseblade/6sckt Phaseblade with a variety of Um/Ber/Shael
Bramble/Duress/CoH
Up'd HoZ/Exile
Drac's/Crafted Blood
Ravenfrost
Dungo's/Crafted Blood
BK/Nature's Peace
Goblin Toe/Gore

I think that the gear listed above would be somewhat the optimal selection for said character, which setup exactly you wish to use willl take some more thinking, but I'd say 99% of the gear would be in that list.

NOTE: I would advise against using Defiance and Thorns at the same time,(whether it be from oskills on gear or you own actual aura's) as Defiance hinders the damage dealt to your minions and in turn the damage they will deal back through Thorns. I personally think Exile is junk, but I put it in there so that it wouldn't be brought up later.
 
Well now.

I guess I may have used someone elses Name concept for this character. If I did I'm sorry. Would anyone like to venture forth and help me think of a new name.
 
Rane- said:
When a monster is converted it recieves your aura. When the conversion wears off they do still keep it for a reasonably short amount of time.

On the note of Conviction again;
Elemental damage does NOT work with smite at all and hence is of absoluty 0 help to you. Using this just to aid your 'teammates' is for lack of a softer word, idiotic. If the only reason you wish to use this over Fanaticism is because you are afraid of your 'betrayers' being Fanatic for a few secs, then use either Defiance as your main aura to keep you alive better, or Thorns and just don't smite them whilst they have the aura on but rather keep attempting to re-convert. Either of these is 900000% better than Conviction for this build. If you really want to use Conviction to aid your party just go make an Avenger.

Gear-wise I was thinking these looked nice;
Guilleame's/CoA
Mara's
Kingslayer Phaseblade/6sckt Phaseblade with a variety of Um/Ber/Shael
Bramble/Duress/CoH
Up'd HoZ/Exile
Drac's/Crafted Blood
Ravenfrost
Dungo's/Crafted Blood
BK/Nature's Peace
Goblin Toe/Gore

I think that the gear listed above would be somewhat the optimal selection for said character, which setup exactly you wish to use willl take some more thinking, but I'd say 99% of the gear would be in that list.

NOTE: I would advise against using Defiance and Thorns at the same time,(whether it be from oskills on gear or you own actual aura's) as Defiance hinders the damage dealt to your minions and in turn the damage they will deal back through Thorns. I personally think Exile is junk, but I put it in there so that it wouldn't be brought up later.
Click to expand...


Rane,
After looking over a skill planner and thinking it over I decided that your point in using fanatism is a better idea. Yes it is a bit risky, but I think with the huge increase in defence from Holy Shield I should should far well.
 
mrbadexample said:
Rane,
After looking over a skill planner and thinking it over I decided that your point in using fanatism is a better idea. Yes it is a bit risky, but I think with the huge increase in defence from Holy Shield I should should far well.
Click to expand...

Just be sure not to do this in HARDCORE.
 
mrbadexample said:
Well now.

I guess I may have used someone elses Name concept for this character. If I did I'm sorry. Would anyone like to venture forth and help me think of a new name.
Click to expand...

Hmmm... you walk among your enemies and turn them against each other... Is dissenter the right word?
 
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