smite(upd zakarum) vs smite(vortex exile)

Oyetsaga09

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Sep 27, 2004
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smite(upd zakarum) vs smite(vortex exile)

Who will win? and if smite exile wins....what would be a good setup to beat a smite exile? :scratch:
 
Oyetsaga09 said:
Who will win? and if smite exile wins....what would be a good setup to beat a smite exile? :scratch:

Both shields will have the same average damage for the Smite skill if at the same levels. Consider the rest of the gear used in a typical Vindicator setup to determine the outcome of this match up:

-CoA (BER+BER) ---> +1 skills
-Enigma ---> +2 skills
-BK Band x 2 --> +2 skills
-Verdungo's
-Bloodfist/Steelrend/Magnus' Skin/LoH/Crafted Blood Gloves
-Gorerider
-Seraphs/Maras/Rose Branded Amulet --> +2/3 skills
-CTA Flail and Lidless (switch) --> +1 skills (from B. Command)
-Annihilus --> +1 skills
-P. Combat x 10 ---> +10 Combat Skills
-Astreon's/Rose Branded War Scepter --> +4/3 Combat Skills
-HoZ/Exile ---> +4 Combat Skills

If user selects the highest +skills equipment he will net +28 skills. If he selects Exile, he will achieve +24 skills. Assuming skill point allocation as follows:

-20 Smite
-20 Holy Shield
-20 Fanaticism
-20 Defiance

Each player will have a considerably high amount of Defense. The only issue is the added defense provided by the Defiance aura on the Exile Vortex Shield. This would cause the Defensive rating of one Vindicator to be higher than the other. The chance to cast lifetap is also what would keep this Vindicator on top of his HoZ opponent. At this point, it really breaks down to who has a greater life pool and greater skill using a Vindicator.

IMHO, a Vindicator using Exile may not be as skilled as the one using an Up'd HoZ...using the added defense provided by this rune word may be this Vindicator's crutch. In my experience, it is best to remove the crutch from said opponent and beat them soundly over the head with it.

True enough, the Vindicator choosing to use an Exile shield may indeed be very skilled. However, there are Vindicator's in the D2 realm known to win many duels without relying on this rune word.
 
in smite vs smite, defense is useless, so the defiance makes no difference. as for the life tap...well...if u want life tap that badly then get a charged wand. keep in mind that HoZ also gives +skills, and its dmg is more consistent (46-46).
 
AznAvatar said:
in smite vs smite, defense is useless, so the defiance makes no difference. as for the life tap...well...if u want life tap that badly then get a charged wand. keep in mind that HoZ also gives +skills, and its dmg is more consistent (46-46).

Indeed. I only commented on the difference in Defense, not mentioning the fact that with Smite defense and AR do not matter. This duel simply breaks down to who has the most life, and when life-tap triggers. I believe there is another post concerning this issue.

If lifetap triggers when Exile Vindicator has half his life or more, he/she will win. If not, the HoZ Vindicator will win. I prefer the +skills and the more consistent damage of the Up'd HoZ.
 
not to mention the high blocking on HoZ saves u a helluva lotta dex. chances are, the HoZ user would have more life.
 
Bah exile.Go with lacerator+upd zak anyday.You may say amp is bm but we're talkin vs. exile smiters.Id prolly even go non upd zak plus lacerator over exile.Your offensive power should more than make up for his lifetap.You should also have higher life too so it will take him way more hits to kill you than for you to kill him when amp casts.
 
D-Giant said:
Bah exile.Go with lacerator+upd zak anyday.You may say amp is bm but we're talkin vs. exile smiters.Id prolly even go non upd zak plus lacerator over exile.Your offensive power should more than make up for his lifetap.You should also have higher life too so it will take him way more hits to kill you than for you to kill him when amp casts.

I agree whole-heartedly. Many of the tactics I employ ar considered BM...I for one fail to see how they grant me any kind of an advantage. If anything, my tactics only level the playing field.

For starters, as a Frost Zealot you don't have an adequate AR for PvP. Also, you defense is low if you chose to pursue damage over defense (since it is thought of as a PvM build). I use Angelic rings and ammy to boost my AR a bit, prebuff with Enchant, and throw on a Beast Caddy. This pushes me up to 21K AR. The Exile shield I use? Not for Smite....it's only to bring my defense up...and it only gets it up to 16K (obscenely LOW).

These are just two examples...but the use of a Lacerator versus an Exile Vindicator is not something I consider BM. In fact, I commend the Lacerator Vindicator for having a firm grasp on how the game works and employing tactics to counter another's. Is this not what PvP is about?

Surely this is a thinking man's game and not just a click-fest. Isn't it?
 
Euro-Crash said:
These are just two examples...but the use of a Lacerator versus an Exile Vindicator is not something I consider BM. In fact, I commend the Lacerator Vindicator for having a firm grasp on how the game works and employing tactics to counter another's. Is this not what PvP is about?

Surely this is a thinking man's game and not just a click-fest. Isn't it?

Do you mean that Lacerator's amp versus an aura stacking Exile user is not BM? If so then I do agree. I do think that BM vs BM is fair in the end.

But if you mean that the whole game is to use "tactics to counter another's" then I disagree; that's where all these minion stacking wind druids and massively defensive teleporting necromancers and little hammerdins came from. D2 isn't meant for pvp so you can't exactly use any "tactics" other than to make an overpowered character.

I don't know if youre commending the Lacerator smiter for using bad mannered gear vs another bad mannered smiter (exile). I hope so, at least.

To me teleporting with a clay golem and having unresistable damage is not really what a thinking man's game means. :cheesy:

I'm not trying to be hostile, sorry if it came off that way. It's just that you brought up a good theory, but I couldn't tell exactly what you meant.
 
Halbreed7250 said:
Up'd HoZ > Veth Exile
agreed, without a doubt, up'd hoz has constant dmg, better skills & better block (more vit like AznAvatar said)
exile is only better vs barbs cause of the big def boost
 
If you don't like a style of play employed by someone who hostiles you, do not fight them. On the same token, if you use tactics that some might consider BM don't gloat about it.

As I said before D2 is a "thinking-man's game". Making a character tha has unresistable damage and telporting arround spamming that particular spell takes little skill and makes the game a "click-fest".

Using items that have particular mod's on them that would give you an advantage or using a skill that is legitimate is something I consider to be perfectly acceptable.

Again, if you don't like what someone is doing...politely ask them to unhostile you. Indicate that you concede victory and have no wish to fight them. Do not incite them with repeated cries of: "WTF man...that's BM...Noob...uses BM to win..."

Whether or not this is the case, using harsh words to admonish something you personally feel is BM is not the best approach to solving this dilemna. A wise man once said to me: "you catch more flies with honey than with vinegar."

Also, avoid any confrontation with the ill-mannered choom and do not cast stones or engage in arguments with them. Another proverb can be applied here: "Wise men don't argue with fools...because from a distance you can't distinguish between the two..."

IMHO, complaining, whining and spamming NOOB is quite possibly the highest form of BM found on the realm...not someone's use of an item or skill you think to be imbalanced or unfair.
 
Euro-Crash said:
If you don't like a style of play employed by someone who hostiles you, do not fight them. On the same token, if you use tactics that some might consider BM don't gloat about it.

As I said before D2 is a "thinking-man's game". Making a character tha has unresistable damage and telporting arround spamming that particular spell takes little skill and makes the game a "click-fest".

Using items that have particular mod's on them that would give you an advantage or using a skill that is legitimate is something I consider to be perfectly acceptable.

Again, if you don't like what someone is doing...politely ask them to unhostile you. Indicate that you concede victory and have no wish to fight them. Do not incite them with repeated cries of: "WTF man...that's BM...Noob...uses BM to win..."

Whether or not this is the case, using harsh words to admonish something you personally feel is BM is not the best approach to solving this dilemna. A wise man once said to me: "you catch more flies with honey than with vinegar."

Also, avoid any confrontation with the ill-mannered choom and do not cast stones or engage in arguments with them. Another proverb can be applied here: "Wise men don't argue with fools...because from a distance you can't distinguish between the two..."

IMHO, complaining, whining and spamming NOOB is quite possibly the highest form of BM found on the realm...not someone's use of an item or skill you think to be imbalanced or unfair.


Nicely done, What is the flamebellow/frostwind bug you mentioned? I've not heard of it.
 
i completely agree- FOR PUBBIES
but when people make specific games with specific regulations and you come in and think you own cause youre using doom or other skills considered bm under the circumstances it tends to promote a bad name for others who use the same gear.

when i say "you" i dont mean ^^ you, i mean it generally

im mainly talking about smiters and frosties comin into a zeal pk game and being asked to leave because they do not meet the criteria, and them calling everyone noobs because "smite pwns joo, noob" it just gets aggravating
 
Ph3NoM said:
i completely agree- FOR PUBBIES
but when people make specific games with specific regulations and you come in and think you own cause youre using doom or other skills considered bm under the circumstances it tends to promote a bad name for others who use the same gear.

when i say "you" i dont mean ^^ you, i mean it generally

im mainly talking about smiters and frosties comin into a zeal pk game and being asked to leave because they do not meet the criteria, and them calling everyone noobs because "smite pwns joo, noob" it just gets aggravating

Exactly...nail hit squarely on the head. That is what dueling leagues, Clan Honor, and Temple PK games are designed for. I built a character for PvM...and I duel Pubby for guess what -----> FUN.

I do not believe in taking the competition to the Nth Degree just to prove my supremacy over someone in a world composed of only hexadecimal representations of fictitious items and skills. If I wanted to do that I would go downstairs to the mail room and beat the hell out of the mail clerk...but for what?

Yes, I have a Frosty...yes, I use Beast, Exile and Demonlimb. On occasion, I shift to Werebear and equip a 6 SHAEL PB. If I get beaten by someone I know I can't beat, I unhostile them and politely ask them to do the same...I admit defeat.

BM in its purest form comes from scroll locking poison Bowazons standing either at the town entrance and taking pot-shots at you only to pop back into town, or out of town and off your screen firing at you when you try to retreive your corpse, town sitting summoner druids, town guarding wind druid/hammerdin/bone-cros, and people who spam all forms of vulgarity and childish banter. Complaining and whining is no exception.

Incidentally, I did not take "you" to mean me. It was a generalization that you made and its intent was well-understood. Also, I don't come into any game thinking I own anyone. In fact, I am sick of that terminology. Further, someone spamming, "smite owns you..." is quite possibly the most incompetent bone-headed nincompoop on the face of the planet.

Tell me how an attack that cannot be blocked, interrupted, or resisted can fail to own pretty much everything? Is this not the BIG DUH of the millenium?
 
Halbreed7250 said:
Nicely done, What is the flamebellow/frostwind bug you mentioned? I've not heard of it.

Flamebellow on a Barb
Frostwind on a Zon

Use of these items on the characters mentioned is bugged. A zon using the Arctic Blast skill endowed by the Frostwind will sometimes disappear. Barbs using a Flamebellow can perform a similar trick, only they become invulnerbable to ANY attack and will take no damage despite having 1 HP. Go to some public games and you will find a Barb hostiling everyone and not moving...people will attack and not hurt him at all.

The downside of exploiting this bug is you cannot move, and though you cannot be killed...you cannot kill. The only thing free to move are your lips and fingertips. Excessive blabbing is a well-known side effect of exploiting this bug.
 
Euro-Crash said:
If you don't like a style of play employed by someone who hostiles you, do not fight them. On the same token, if you use tactics that some might consider BM don't gloat about it.

As I said before D2 is a "thinking-man's game". Making a character tha has unresistable damage and telporting arround spamming that particular spell takes little skill and makes the game a "click-fest".

Using items that have particular mod's on them that would give you an advantage or using a skill that is legitimate is something I consider to be perfectly acceptable.

Again, if you don't like what someone is doing...politely ask them to unhostile you. Indicate that you concede victory and have no wish to fight them. Do not incite them with repeated cries of: "WTF man...that's BM...Noob...uses BM to win..."

Whether or not this is the case, using harsh words to admonish something you personally feel is BM is not the best approach to solving this dilemna. A wise man once said to me: "you catch more flies with honey than with vinegar."

Also, avoid any confrontation with the ill-mannered choom and do not cast stones or engage in arguments with them. Another proverb can be applied here: "Wise men don't argue with fools...because from a distance you can't distinguish between the two..."

IMHO, complaining, whining and spamming NOOB is quite possibly the highest form of BM found on the realm...not someone's use of an item or skill you think to be imbalanced or unfair.

Ah very nice. I do agree then :O
 
Euro-Crash said:
Flamebellow on a Barb
Frostwind on a Zon

Use of these items on the characters mentioned is bugged. A zon using the Arctic Blast skill endowed by the Frostwind will sometimes disappear. Barbs using a Flamebellow can perform a similar trick, only they become invulnerbable to ANY attack and will take no damage despite having 1 HP. Go to some public games and you will find a Barb hostiling everyone and not moving...people will attack and not hurt him at all.

The downside of exploiting this bug is you cannot move, and though you cannot be killed...you cannot kill. The only thing free to move are your lips and fingertips. Excessive blabbing is a well-known side effect of exploiting this bug.


I've never hurd of the frostwind one b4 wierd, probly explains alot of funny stuff ive seen. can they be seen on the map?

the flamebellow one works great v tg trap sins i can get a friend in there to do that, then wack a cheap a*s
 
how about lacerator and exile! :evil:
why would eth lacerator matter? is it worth getting eth or is it just the same non? only thing i can think of is charge
:creep:
 
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