- Feb 24, 2006
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I tip my hat (and genuflect with deep respect) to the folks that worked so hard (much of the work is still underway!) to migrate and preserve content from the old site. This thread is my attempt to do something that shows gratitude to everyone involved. More than just saying "thanks," I wanted to produce something tangible that would add value to the migrated content.
Regarding Items and Skills
I'm not the first to assert as fact this idea: that the two main factors that contribute to success playing a Diablo II character are, in order of importance: (1) good equipped items, and (2) wise investment of stats and skills.
For items, we're pretty much at the mercy of the fickle minor deity whom we reverently call "PRNG." Notice how the Item Find Thread gets so much attention. In that thread, we celebrate the "blessings" occasionally bestowed by Pseudo-Random-Number-Generator (peace be upon her). I wonder: are there any other threads here that get more contributions, views, and likes?
But skills - those choices are under each player's complete control! Regardless of item wealth or trading opportunities, we are all able to enjoy the awesome consequences of our skill selections. When we consider our characters' skill allocations, a favorite resource here seems to be the most popular of the "pinned" threads: the SPF Mat/Pat/Guardian Build Compliation. I love that thread. I'm so pleased it was migrated successfully. I consult it frequently for ideas and inspiration about how to plan skill point investment choices. I also enjoy exploring it just simply for admiration and entertainment.
When we browse through our SPF P/M/Gs thread, we observe many examples of build ideas that have become widely popular, because of how quickly they enable players to achieve success. In starting a new project a few months ago, I also selected to use such "easy" builds, so that I could quickly advance my first few characters to patriarch/matriarch. But as @broxi_111 recently reminded us with #ThisBuildSUCKS challenge, trying to defeat hell difficulty Baal with skills and builds that are less popular, or even unique, is also very appealing.
What are some of the skills that have had little or no representation among SPF M/P/Gs? Do those merit further exploration? Also, are there interesting qualities yet to be discovered in the commonly used skills and builds?
Data driven skill census and analysis
To study those questions, I spent the last several weeks compiling and summarizing the skill investment levels reported in the SPF Mat/Pat/Guardian build compilation thread. I have attached the results here as seven CSV spreadsheet files, one for each hero class. I used the following methodology to collect these data:
Every skill has a column in a spreadsheet; these are organized by skill tree columns. Every reported Mat/Pat/Guardian (hopefully I haven't accidentally omitted one) in the compilation has a row. Each cell contains a number between 1 and 20, showing how many skill points were invested in that skill for that character. If no points were invested in that skill, the cell is left blank. Sadly, despite my best effort, I am not able to make the data 100% accurate, but I plan to edit and update the attachments, in order to correct errors I find or others point out. Happily, for most characters, exact skill investments were reported in their Mat/Pat/Guardian post. (GoMule text dumps for the win!) Very often, I tried to use this handy check for data validity: I could verify that the total skill points spent were equal to eleven more than the character's achieved level.
Unfortunately, sometimes an M/P/G post only reported some of the skill point counts. A common phrase among these was "...and the usual one-point wonders." If I could find clues as to exactly what those skills were, I recorded them. (Example: if a post about a sorceress includes a description about teleporting past a nasty unbreakable immune, I inferred that a point must have been invested in both telekinesis and teleport, and thus recorded it in the spreadsheet.) But if I could find no such clues, I usually left a spreadsheet cell blank, rather than just guess at what was their actual skill investment. In principle, I wanted to err on the side of conservative accuracy, rather than speculate. (Example: when there was only one skill point unaccounted for, but I can't tell whether it was used for frozen armor, static field, or warmth as the one-point-wonder, therefore all three were left blank. Another example: if a post listed "...all remaining skill points in holy shield," but I couldn't figure out how many points that would have been because the character's Patriarch level was never noted, then I recorded 2 points in holy shield. Reason: there must have been more than one point invested, and the actual hard points in the skill may well have been higher, but the actual investment couldn't be determined.)
Also, I tried to give the benefit of doubt to each contributor, presuming all skill declarations to be accurate as reported. For example: if any of the Pat/Mat/Guardian posts reported more skills point invested than would have been possible for a character's reported level, I just assumed that the reported level was that at which hell Baal was first defeated, and the character must have gained more levels and invested more skill points since achieving Mat/Pat/Guardian.
Sometimes, I could find no skill data at all in a Mat/Pat/Guardian post. The most common reason for this was because the skill data was included as links to skill tree screen capture images that no longer exist; most of these are broken links to sites such as ImageShack. For a few of these, I could infer skill data based on other items in the report, such as skill damages copied from an LCS. But if I could find no skill data at all, I put a row of x's in the spreadsheet for that character, which, unfortunately, effectively excluded that character from the skills census.
After I searched through each Pat/Mat/Guardian post and filled out each spreadsheet, I analyzed overall investment of each skill with histograms. Over the next few days/weeks, I will post those statistics, along with some of my thoughts and observations. Feel free to add to this conversation if you're interested or you have thoughts of your own to share.
Preface: the default skills
Before I discuss invested skill points, please let me quickly mention the three "level 0" skills that every character always gets without investment: attack, throw, and unsummon.
Attack (normal attack)
I use normal attack all the time with my favorite build: the druid hunter. If you aren't an Amazon, and you use a bow or crossbow, it may well be the only weapon-based attack skill available. Some other notable builds that might have to rely on this skill are single-tree builds without 0skill items, such as aura-only Paladins, "mojo" (curse tree only) Necromancers, mastery-only Barbarians, and passive Amazons. I think my favorite write-up of a normal-attack matriarch Amazon is this one: Zaira, by @Vildecor .
*Swamigoon stuffs tongue firmly into cheek* - A participation trophy goes to these posts in the M/P/G compilation, who also specialized exclusively in normal attack: Melonfarmer, by AJK and One, by @Drystan .
Throw (throw equipped item)
Several of my untwinked characters successfully used this skill with fulminating potions against normal difficulty Andy. I also played a bit with an axe- and kinfe-throwing necromancer once, years ago, but he's still stuck in NM act 5. I believe it's pretty difficult for throw to be effective without some amazing gear and support. My favorite write-up of a thrower: Arien, by @Pb_pal .
Unsummon
I use unsummon rarely, in very particular situations. One such situation is the Maggot Lair in act 2. I generally want my mercenary to help fight bugs in those tight passageways, but sometimes he can't because he's stuck behind one of my summoned minions. In those situations, it's usually best to re-summon the obstacle to a more useful spot farther down the passageway, but when fighting around tight corners, I often just need to unsummon instead. I also used unsummon recently for some Assassin pit run experiments, in which I needed to do some runs without bringing a supporting shadow minion into the pit.
-
Okay, now I'll look at the rest of the skills, starting with the first column in the Amazon's Javelin and Spear Skills tree, her physical melee skills. If you enjoy this thread and you want to chime in, or even take me to task about my findings or opinions, please do! - Swamigoon
Regarding Items and Skills
I'm not the first to assert as fact this idea: that the two main factors that contribute to success playing a Diablo II character are, in order of importance: (1) good equipped items, and (2) wise investment of stats and skills.
For items, we're pretty much at the mercy of the fickle minor deity whom we reverently call "PRNG." Notice how the Item Find Thread gets so much attention. In that thread, we celebrate the "blessings" occasionally bestowed by Pseudo-Random-Number-Generator (peace be upon her). I wonder: are there any other threads here that get more contributions, views, and likes?
But skills - those choices are under each player's complete control! Regardless of item wealth or trading opportunities, we are all able to enjoy the awesome consequences of our skill selections. When we consider our characters' skill allocations, a favorite resource here seems to be the most popular of the "pinned" threads: the SPF Mat/Pat/Guardian Build Compliation. I love that thread. I'm so pleased it was migrated successfully. I consult it frequently for ideas and inspiration about how to plan skill point investment choices. I also enjoy exploring it just simply for admiration and entertainment.
When we browse through our SPF P/M/Gs thread, we observe many examples of build ideas that have become widely popular, because of how quickly they enable players to achieve success. In starting a new project a few months ago, I also selected to use such "easy" builds, so that I could quickly advance my first few characters to patriarch/matriarch. But as @broxi_111 recently reminded us with #ThisBuildSUCKS challenge, trying to defeat hell difficulty Baal with skills and builds that are less popular, or even unique, is also very appealing.
What are some of the skills that have had little or no representation among SPF M/P/Gs? Do those merit further exploration? Also, are there interesting qualities yet to be discovered in the commonly used skills and builds?
Data driven skill census and analysis
To study those questions, I spent the last several weeks compiling and summarizing the skill investment levels reported in the SPF Mat/Pat/Guardian build compilation thread. I have attached the results here as seven CSV spreadsheet files, one for each hero class. I used the following methodology to collect these data:
Every skill has a column in a spreadsheet; these are organized by skill tree columns. Every reported Mat/Pat/Guardian (hopefully I haven't accidentally omitted one) in the compilation has a row. Each cell contains a number between 1 and 20, showing how many skill points were invested in that skill for that character. If no points were invested in that skill, the cell is left blank. Sadly, despite my best effort, I am not able to make the data 100% accurate, but I plan to edit and update the attachments, in order to correct errors I find or others point out. Happily, for most characters, exact skill investments were reported in their Mat/Pat/Guardian post. (GoMule text dumps for the win!) Very often, I tried to use this handy check for data validity: I could verify that the total skill points spent were equal to eleven more than the character's achieved level.
Unfortunately, sometimes an M/P/G post only reported some of the skill point counts. A common phrase among these was "...and the usual one-point wonders." If I could find clues as to exactly what those skills were, I recorded them. (Example: if a post about a sorceress includes a description about teleporting past a nasty unbreakable immune, I inferred that a point must have been invested in both telekinesis and teleport, and thus recorded it in the spreadsheet.) But if I could find no such clues, I usually left a spreadsheet cell blank, rather than just guess at what was their actual skill investment. In principle, I wanted to err on the side of conservative accuracy, rather than speculate. (Example: when there was only one skill point unaccounted for, but I can't tell whether it was used for frozen armor, static field, or warmth as the one-point-wonder, therefore all three were left blank. Another example: if a post listed "...all remaining skill points in holy shield," but I couldn't figure out how many points that would have been because the character's Patriarch level was never noted, then I recorded 2 points in holy shield. Reason: there must have been more than one point invested, and the actual hard points in the skill may well have been higher, but the actual investment couldn't be determined.)
Also, I tried to give the benefit of doubt to each contributor, presuming all skill declarations to be accurate as reported. For example: if any of the Pat/Mat/Guardian posts reported more skills point invested than would have been possible for a character's reported level, I just assumed that the reported level was that at which hell Baal was first defeated, and the character must have gained more levels and invested more skill points since achieving Mat/Pat/Guardian.
Sometimes, I could find no skill data at all in a Mat/Pat/Guardian post. The most common reason for this was because the skill data was included as links to skill tree screen capture images that no longer exist; most of these are broken links to sites such as ImageShack. For a few of these, I could infer skill data based on other items in the report, such as skill damages copied from an LCS. But if I could find no skill data at all, I put a row of x's in the spreadsheet for that character, which, unfortunately, effectively excluded that character from the skills census.
After I searched through each Pat/Mat/Guardian post and filled out each spreadsheet, I analyzed overall investment of each skill with histograms. Over the next few days/weeks, I will post those statistics, along with some of my thoughts and observations. Feel free to add to this conversation if you're interested or you have thoughts of your own to share.
Preface: the default skills
Before I discuss invested skill points, please let me quickly mention the three "level 0" skills that every character always gets without investment: attack, throw, and unsummon.
Attack (normal attack)
I use normal attack all the time with my favorite build: the druid hunter. If you aren't an Amazon, and you use a bow or crossbow, it may well be the only weapon-based attack skill available. Some other notable builds that might have to rely on this skill are single-tree builds without 0skill items, such as aura-only Paladins, "mojo" (curse tree only) Necromancers, mastery-only Barbarians, and passive Amazons. I think my favorite write-up of a normal-attack matriarch Amazon is this one: Zaira, by @Vildecor .
*Swamigoon stuffs tongue firmly into cheek* - A participation trophy goes to these posts in the M/P/G compilation, who also specialized exclusively in normal attack: Melonfarmer, by AJK and One, by @Drystan .
Throw (throw equipped item)
Several of my untwinked characters successfully used this skill with fulminating potions against normal difficulty Andy. I also played a bit with an axe- and kinfe-throwing necromancer once, years ago, but he's still stuck in NM act 5. I believe it's pretty difficult for throw to be effective without some amazing gear and support. My favorite write-up of a thrower: Arien, by @Pb_pal .
Unsummon
I use unsummon rarely, in very particular situations. One such situation is the Maggot Lair in act 2. I generally want my mercenary to help fight bugs in those tight passageways, but sometimes he can't because he's stuck behind one of my summoned minions. In those situations, it's usually best to re-summon the obstacle to a more useful spot farther down the passageway, but when fighting around tight corners, I often just need to unsummon instead. I also used unsummon recently for some Assassin pit run experiments, in which I needed to do some runs without bringing a supporting shadow minion into the pit.
-
Okay, now I'll look at the rest of the skills, starting with the first column in the Amazon's Javelin and Spear Skills tree, her physical melee skills. If you enjoy this thread and you want to chime in, or even take me to task about my findings or opinions, please do! - Swamigoon
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