RFL 2021 When?

[PhineasB]

@maxicek asked when RFL might fall this spring, so I figured I should post a thread to gauge interest and finalize the schedule. I was thinking to keep the same general timeline of starting mid-March, so either 12 March or 19 March for Round 1 start and Round 3 wrapping up at the end of May. We'll keep the same 3-week rounds, with 1-week break between. Background on RFL can be found here, and more generally the RFL threads in the tournament listings thread (scroll down) maintained through the phenomenal work of @Pb_pal

That also reminds me that I need to finish migrating the RFL running threads, which I apparently never finished. A nice goal between now and Round 1 I'm leaning toward 12 March, but please let me know if 19 March works better. Looking forward to this, as RFL is always epic.

 

[art_vandelay]

I'm for the earliest possible date, so March 12th is fine for me!

On another note: I can make rune scores for 1.08/1.09, could we maybe allow those versions to enter as well? That is of course if the score for a Zod in those versions doesn't scare people too much

 

[Babyhell]

Due to current (and incoming) additional activities, I will just hope to complete one or two sets during the whole period #NobodyCaresBut. So well, the earlier the better for me too, that's being said.

@art_vandelay I'm not afraid of 1.0x scores. But will certainly be stunned by reading those!

 

[ffs]

I expect to have little D2 time in April, so the earlier the better/12 March would be my preference... But will participate in any case ofc.

 

[maxicek]

+1 for the earlier start date.

I think I killed the Cow King last time with my Necro, so I better get an alternative necro ready.

 

[Luhkoh]

Earliest possible for me (should we consider earlier than march 12?). First baby is due in June . Will participate as much as I can regardless.

I would also like to propose again changing the schedule from 21 days on, 7 days off to 17 days on, 4 days off. This would make the round start on a friday and end on a sunday, allowing the end of the round to be binged over a weekend. I think that feels more epic than trickling in a few extra runs through the workweek anyways. And I feel like the breaks between rounds are a bit long right now. If you finish a smidge early, you have time to practically forget about the tourney before the next round.

I think the current rfl format just takes up a lot of space in the year. Which it's my favorite tourney, so not a big deal at all, but I do think this would be a big improvement. Would take the total days from 77 to 59.

Anyways certainly not a big thing for me, but I think it would be a good change. Let me know what you think!

 

[Babyhell]

@Luhkoh I guess there's no better time to try this configuration than...this year.

Well I deleted all the reasoning, but in the end, it seems to be a matter of definition of the core use of this tournament towards the SPF community: "materially opened to the most, or flagship for the tops" (so to speak)?

I feel like the shorter the time window is, the less participants we may get, but the competition duration saved is also a good point to involve people less longer and maybe able to put the effort during 60 days instead of 70 (see? I don't want to be absolute in any way!).

Adding the 1.08/1.09 scores on the other side would allow some more entries, maybe for @art_vandelay if he has some idea behind that - even if I don't see him not participate, or @HanShotFirst with his hammerdin (1.09 iirc).

Also, I want to worth around this idea of being a parent: we shall have a compensation for sleeping issues #joking

 

[Luhkoh]

@Babyhell I don't think that change will make the rfl less open to everyone in any substantial way. I mean of course there's technically less time allotted to get the 20 hours done in, but in my experience, the only people putting in a big effort in those last 5 workdays are the maniacs trying to complete their 3rd set (looking at @art_vandelay) . And its only 63 vs 51 actual days of running. Plus, starting on a friday and ending on sunday just feels appropriate for a proper tourney ^^.

I don't have any preference on allowing other game versions. I sorta feel like the wide differences in scores and complicated variations in scoring make the community aspect of the tournament decrease a bit, but then I'm sure it encourages more entrants, which I am very much in favor of.

 

[Pb_pal]

I'm game for any timeframe. Though I might skip the council this year as SC is starting to lose its interest for me, and I'm a bit wary to build a HC trav runner that's safe enough (yet still fast) for my less-than-ideal playstyle.

 

[Babyhell]

I'm game for any timeframe. Though I might skip the council this year as SC is starting to lose its interest for me, and I'm a bit wary to build a HC trav runner that's safe enough (yet still fast) for my less-than-ideal playstyle.

My less-than-ideal HC zealer got 2 Cham last year, so it can still score ;-) If you need something in 1.14d HC, I may help

 

[Pb_pal]

My less-than-ideal HC zealer got 2 Cham last year, so it can still score ;-) If you need something in 1.14d HC, I may help

oo I forgot about him. I'll go look him up. I have plenty of items/roonz in HC so it's not that (thanks for the offer though!), it's more an issue of me getting off my butt and theorycrafting something that will be safe and I'll enjoy. And then of course finding the time to actually build it in amongst all my other projects. Then again, what's one more thing on the "to-do" list gonna hurt, anyways?

 

[Zyr]

Then again, what's one more thing on the "to-do" list gonna hurt, anyways?

Thanks-- I needed that!

 

[Vildecor]

I would also like to propose again changing the schedule from 21 days on, 7 days off to 17 days on, 4 days off. This would make the round start on a friday and end on a sunday, allowing the end of the round to be binged over a weekend. I think that feels more epic than trickling in a few extra runs through the workweek anyways. And I feel like the breaks between rounds are a bit long right now. If you finish a smidge early, you have time to practically forget about the tourney before the next round.

I won't have characters ready to participate this year, but I did want to chime in and say I do like the idea of this altered schedule. It should still be plenty of time for those who like to run two sets, as well as enough to squeeze in one 20-hour set for those who have busy lives.

And since I won't be competing this year, I'll at least get some trash talk done:

All you competitors better enjoy this year, because in 2022 I'll have some characters chomping at the bits to steal all your luck!

 

[Luhkoh]

@Vildecor all I'll say on having ready characters is: two years ago I participated with some truly awful characters and barely scored worse than I did last year . If I had to start over today, I'd rush up a blizz sorc and go max block with whatever gear and lifer charms for cows, run the same blizz sorc for trav with a map where torc is separate from the other 10 (and skip torc), and maybe run p3 AT or p7 pindle with her for round 3. So no pressure, but would love to see you in there . I will also be glad to give you some starter gear if you take a solemn oath to back up your files weekly .

 

[art_vandelay]

@PhineasB The scores for 1.07 are slightly off due to a bug not taken into account when they were created. They should really be:

​	Cows​	Travincal​	Normal​	Wraith​
Pul​	19,3​	8,8​	17,8​	14,7​
Um​	29,0​	13,2​	26,8​	22,0​
Mal​	38,5​	17,5​	35,5​	29,3​
Ist​	57,8​	26,3​	53,3​	43,9​
Gul​	76,9​	35,0​	70,9​	58,4​
Vex​	115,3​	52,5​	106,4​	87,7​
Ohm​	152,4​	69,4​	140,7​	115,9​
Lo​	228,7​	104,0​	211,0​	173,9​
Sur​	307,0​	139,7​	283,3​	233,4​
Ber​	460,5​	209,5​	424,9​	350,1​
Jo​	613,5​	279,1​	566,1​	466,4​
Cham​	920,2​	418,6​	849,1​	699,6​
Zod​	736,5​	-​	679,6​	560,0​

I used @Luhkoh 's sheet to get these scores. Note how the scores for Areas in the 2020 Running Thread are the same as Cows for 1.07 which can't be right... They should be different from Cows.

Also a brief explanation on the bug that caused the scores to change:

Spoiler

In 1.07 the game recalculates the nodrop even in the case of players 1. However in this specific calculation floating point numbers are used (in contrast to the integer math used for most of the game) and instead of returning the nodrop "as is" the game returns nodrop-1 due to a rounding error. So for players 1 all nodrops have to be decremented once.

***

I also produced scores for all versions 1.09-1.13a in case you want to expand the versions allowed:

​	1.09​	1.10a-1.12​	1.13a​	1.13c+​
Pul​	13,4​	13,4​	13,4​	3,4​
Um​	20,1​	20,1​	20,1​	5,1​
Mal​	26,7​	23,4​	19,8​	5​
Ist​	40,1​	35,1​	29,7​	7,5​
Gul​	53,4​	40,9​	28,2​	7,1​
Vex​	80​	61,3​	42,3​	10,6​
Ohm​	106,7​	71,5​	40,2​	10,1​
Lo​	160​	107,2​	60,4​	15,1​
Sur​	213,3​	125​	54,5​	13,7​
Ber​	319,9​	187,6​	81,7​	20,5​
Jah​	426,5​	218,8​	73,6​	18,3​
Cham​	639,8​	328,2​	110,4​	27,5​
Zod​	2559,1​	1148,5​	287,1​	71,8​

The thinking here is that the drop process for cows, council members, regular monsters and wraiths did not change since 1.09, only the rarity of runes changed which means that for all versions 1.09-1.14d there is only one set of scores.
I got those scores by dividing the respective chance for a rune from runes17 TC by the chance for a 1.14d Mal from runes17 TC, inverting that value, multiplying it by 5 and then rounding with one digit precision.

 

[Babyhell]

1.09 Zod FTW! #Stunned

 

[Swamigoon]

March start sounds good to me. Based on the info recently verified by Fruit, I wonder: might a lightning trap assassin still be a competitive rune-finder?

 

[Vildecor]

@Luhkoh - Well, my blizzard will be done pretty quickly, so maybe I might decide to try at least the Trav round.

 

[Luhkoh]

@Pb_pal go go trav zealot! But what are you running for cows? That area feels less safe to me than trav (sentiment not backed up by HC experience).

 

[Pb_pal]

@Pb_pal go go trav zealot! But what are you running for cows? That area feels less safe to me than trav (sentiment not backed up by HC experience).

Fire druid! I've run him in several RFLs so far with great success. He's not as complete a killer as the zons and necros, but he competes quite well time-wise and is very safe once you get the hang of staying out of the action.