Operation: WTG builds baba again!

[w.t.g]

Operation: WTG builds baba again!

Hi all!
I have allways been big fan of barbarisns, actually my 1st diablo 2 lod char was whirler. I still remeber when i got my 1st bloodletter and i was like "wtf, can this be true?!" :lol: . Unfortunately in 1.10 all melee charectors are much less powerfull than in 1.09, so i haven't played so much melee chars; more casters. Few days back i decided to make barbarian!

I did go to HC channel to trade my gear away. I didn't got anything valuable, but i got my hands on Thunder maul botd 350% ed ( i know, it's bad). I tried that tm on my IK baba, and i was quite impressed, over 10k ww, not bad, is it? However, IK baba requires huge amount of str, so i got over 300 str when equipped. I was thinking to build new, better baba, which is using that TM.

New barb! I was planning old school ww, but then i noticed berserker quide. Berserker can deal huge damage, and i like damage :winner: . Only one bad thing: defence is zero. This char is mainly purpused on having fun, so i was thinking:"wth, let's try it!!!". And here i am, writing my story...

What do you think, zerker or ww for having fun? expiriences?

Gear that i am planning to use:
weapon: Oh, this is my baby, the one who deals huge damage, it is my dear tm 350 eth!
helm: two good choises, arreat or gaze?
armor: i need help here, if i go for ww, then i use most likely stone rw (1.9k def) but if i go for zerk?
boots: wt(mf, str,vita,dmg) or aldur(life)
gloves: IK mayby? eth tm still requires 19x str and i dont have ogre gountless, ik glovs combined with boots or belt gives nice 25% ias.
belt: IK? str, res
jewerly: angelic combo all the way! ( mayby raven on other finger)

Some info:
-I will go with base dex
-i play on Eu Hcl
-critic is allways good to have, but please not enything like this:"OMG u nOOb that build & gear SuXXor!!111"

Thank you all for help in advance!

-W.t.g :drink:

 

[Two_Rivers]

You might want to try both, max out zerk, have it be your main attack. Then point a point, or maybe a couple a points into ww for life and mana leech. If your going zerk don't forget about warcry!

As for equip I would suggest:
Helm: Arreats (Vamp is only good for DR and we'll get that else where)
Armor: I'm leaning toward a good leviathan (DR and strength and def all in one)
Gloves: hmm ik has potential, but I wonder if lifetap works for bezerk, wouldn't that be fun, I need to test.
Belt: T-gods (stength and light res goodness) or Dungo's (crucial DR and life)
Boots: ik boots if using gloves, otherwise travs
Jewelry: Raven, Highlords, BK ring (you don't need the ar that angelics gives you for pvm)

One last note: I don't think I would play hardcore (well I don't play hardcore at all:uhhuh: ) without a shield, but its your call, good luck!

 

[King1]

There are Zerker and Whirlwind guides in the Sticky if you would like to check them out. They can help you a lot more than I can. All I have to say is that Zerk probably won't work if you are going no dex, since you will have zero defense and no blocking, you will always get hit [which I assume you don't want unless you're a masochist or something..]...Anyways..check the Sticky.

 

[rikstaker1]

All I have to say is that Zerk probably won't work if you are going no dex, since you will have zero defense and no blocking, you will always get hit [which I assume you don't want unless you're a masochist or something..]...Anyways..check the Sticky.

Actually2h zerkers work much better than weapon shield ones.With a shield,you will be inturrupted frequently in block.0 defense means shield is at work blocking attacks & while at it,your zerk swings are inturrupted,since it is not uniturruptible like conc.This is when warcry comes in.Stunned enemies cant attack you,allowing you free hits.Since they cant attack,he can by all means throw his shield away & use high end 2handers for massive damage.

For the build:
max zerk
max mastery
max shout
max bo
rest into warcry
1 ww for leech.

Shout is a better synergy than howl since it boosts defense of your mercenary,defense to you when not using zerk(ww/conc for leeching) & longer bo/bc duration.A base howl with few plus to skills gives you enough howl radius & chance of cause to flee.


@two rivers:
As a matter of fact some folks have made guardians out of 2hzerkers using weapons like upped to elite steeldriver.But I wouldnt advise it with or without shield,the safest skill for hardcore is conc.

Life tap can trigger with zerk but you cant leech with zerk since the damage is magical.Your eq suggestion is solid however,just change the belt to ik to get 25% ias as set bonus.25 strength,lit & fire resists are great as well.Boots should be gores.

Razgriz.
-----------------
Jordy was right,I'd better work on the zerk guide first,BVB later.

 

[w.t.g]

Ok, my zerker is lvl 16 Atm. I have one point in shout, howl and mace mastery. I try to save skills at low lvls and get max bo and zerk soon as possible.

For gear, i've been thinking something like this:
armor: shaft, mayby up'd, with p ruby (extra life hever hurts)
helm:arreat
wpn: my precious....
Ring: raven, and dwarf? where do i get ar if i don't use angelic?
amu: well, where is that ar? highlord if i manage to get ar elsewhere
boots: well, i try to go with minimum str, so wt/sandstorm gives nice str boost.'
gloves: ik, str is needed to str bug items on!
belt: tg

But, if i would use leviathan+gaze and mayby bul sword on stash, i would look GODLY on channels. Coolness is everything Oh, i forgot to ask one thing: where do i get resistances? arreat gives some, natural res, anya, but i don´t think it will be enough if i wanna maxed resistances on hell. If i use raven, dwarf and tg, i get all elemental absorbs, but i don't think they are gonna help much without decent res?

Anyway, i try to get baba to normal baal runs today, and xp him all the way to lvl 45, when i hope i get nm rush (for forge?). In nm baals i can get him to lvl 75, when i can equip my end game gear and i am ready to hell!

I also read Hal´s conc quide, and...i was pretty impressed. Huge defence, but lacks in damage, is it worth it? damage is king after all! How much damage can conc tm baba archive with might merc? how about zerker?

Thank you all for back up!
-W.t.g

 

[jordy666]

Jordy was right,I'd better work on the zerk guide first,BVB later.

i always am :uhhuh: .
2 handed zerkers rock, but im more a ribcracker person myself.
but a ebotdtm isnt a bad choice

-jordy :king:

 

[Halciet]

Huge defence, but lacks in damage

That is not correct; conc barbs have very high damage, their downfall is one-at-a-time killing and reliance on IAS (like a berserker, they can only get to nine frames).

With your 350 tmaul, a nice selection of charms, and high-end gear with ed jewel socketing, you're looking at around 11-12k max, probably 14-15k with a might merc.

-Hal

 

[rikstaker1]

Huge defence, but lacks in damage

In case that was a slip of the finger,Suggest you use the preview mode,I take 5 minutes to compose my avg posts,10 minutes in preview mode.Necessary to avoid dangerous situations.

What drove you to make a statement that conc barbs lack in damage?

Razgriz

 

[w.t.g]

In case that was a slip of the finger,Suggest you use the preview mode,I take 5 minutes to compose my avg posts,10 minutes in preview mode.Necessary to avoid dangerous situations.

What drove you to make a statement that conc barbs lack in damage?

Razgriz

Are you saying that they don't? :scratch:
Like Hal said: they can get only 11-12k damage? i though zerk makes a lot of more? am i complitely wrong? how much maxed zerk can do dmg?

edit: please, don't understand wrong, 12k is huge damage, swinging speed of TM is slow, so if i hit 13frame (1.9times/sec) it is "only" about 20k maximum damage/second, not counting critical, ds and other damage mods.

How many frame ww i would get with botd tm? And which is better hybrid, ww+zerk or ww+conc? or even conc+zerk?

-W.t.g :innocent:

 

[Halciet]

Berserk will do more damage, overall, as it has huge damage bonuses. On the other hand, Berserk can't leech, it sets your defense to zero, and it's interruptible, so you're not guaranteed that you'll even get a swing off. Conc can leech, adds several hundred % to your defense, and can't be interrupted, period. The point is that conc does do a massive amount of damage, but has a lower killing speed than some of the other barb skills (since whirlwind hits more targets more times per second and berserk does more damage per swing). It's just in the phrasing, heh heh.

As for your hybrids options, the only one that I could support in any way would be the berserk/conc one, since berserk synergizes conc. Don't get me wrong, they'd all work well, but in reality it's pointless to max two combat skills, as you'll find you're only really using one of the two, and thus the other becomes a waste of skillpoints that could've been better spent in something peretually useful to you, like a synergy or ironskin or such.

What it really boils down to is:

If you want MASSIVE damage at the cost of safety, go with Berserk.

If you want large damage and bolstered defenses, go with Conc.

If you want good damage and crowd control, go with Whirlwind.

Out of them all, the whirlers seem to be the fastest killers, since they hit more targets per use, and they still have high conc and berserk damages thanks to synergies. You'd hit the second whirl break with a BotD thundermaul, out of three.

The berserker would undoubtedly be fun, as it's great to see a huge amount of damage like that. The range and speed are kind've slow, but you could make up for that with warcry, as Razgriz mentioned; he knows what he's talking about when it comes to berserkers

The conc barb will be powerful and extremely secure, but it's not everyone's cup of tea, since you have to hit one target at a time and it doesn't do the damage berserk does.

What would be interesting would be to pit berserk vs conc in a kill speed test, to see which one actually kills faster. I'm curious about it since with bersek, you have to play a bit safer and use your warcries a lot more to insure survival, while the conc barb can just wade into combat without fear. I assume the berserker would still outstrip the conc barb, but it might be closer than we imagine.

-Hal

 

[w.t.g]

OK, thank you Hal! You helped a lot.
Now another nooby Q, i get second bp, right? does that mean 5 fps attack?If i hit 5times/second with 10k ww, it wouldn't be that bad after all, it just lacks in AR. I could use dual angelics to get ar...hmm..ww started to sound so good...Mayby i level my zerker 1st, and after that i'll try ww baba :idea:

-W.t.g

 

[w.t.g]

My zerker is lvl 70 atm. He got fallowing gear:
arreat
botd tm
ik belt/verudungo
ik gloves
shaft
wt
angelic amu
angelic ring+dwarf
some life charms
bo weapons

total life: 3.9k
dmg: 13k max (no merc)
not maxed resists on nm

Skills:
max zerk
max bo
11 shout
1howl
about 5 in mace mastery
1 point wonders

Thanks for your help Hal and Razgriz :wave:
Any advise for my resist problems?

 

[rikstaker1]

The berserker would undoubtedly be fun, as it's great to see a huge amount of damage like that. The range and speed are kind've slow, but you could make up for that with warcry, as Razgriz mentioned; he knows what he's talking about when it comes to berserkers & WHIRLERS

:uhhuh:

Wtg-hal covered it pretty well didn’t he. Regardless of what you do, you shouldn’t max two combat skills.

Like he mentioned, conc is not a weak skill, its real strength is its uninturuptibility(over zerk).You pick an enemy, place your mouse down on him, till he falls,pick the next target, place mouse move onto the next…..You are never interrupted in your swings, hardly hit due to your massive defense, those that breakthrough will be stopped by block-a shield is recommended for concers & those that still land, will be reduced by dr & due to uninturruptible strikes the damage is quickly repaired with leech.

Whirlers are undoubtedly the fastest killers but more gear dependent.

Zerkers are no doubt the most advanced & should be tried by experience players only. We have two major problems that we need to correct inorder to use it as a main attack: 0 defense & no leech.

Warcry-I have covered that above, against stunnable monsters zerk converts itself into conc as you let go a barrage of massive magical damage on stunned enemies unable to hitback & interrupt your attacks.

No leech-This can only be corrected to some extent. Just like concers & whirlers use zerk as backup against PIs, zerkers must rely on ww/conc to leech back life & mana supply.

In the end its not a matter of which skill is superior, it is dependent on the player. I like all skills, but I prefer offense, so I am inclined towards zerkers & whirlers. But that doesn’t mean I think conc is weak-no. My concern is the same as hal, it’s a bit simplistic-that’s all, but the build is really solid in pvm & melee pvp & no-doubt the top choice for hardcore.

Onto which kills fast,I’d say conc in early-mid game, but zerk would narrow the gap & scoot ahead in endgame, as physical resists & life climb.

Re your setup:

If possible:

Change armor to levi & socket with p.diamond.
Boots must be gores-the deadly & cb outweighs the minimum/max & stats from travelers.
Use highlords wrath, berserk provides huge ar boost & your weapon is defensecut,so you can get by with lower ar. Use dual ravens or raven/bk.Wrath gives crucial lightning resists as well.

Invest about 10 into warcry atm & continue as is.

Re my earlier post, don’t worry, I was poking fun at you & Hal-since he is the conc Viking here & would step in whenever there is slight hint of incorrect comment on it.

Razgriz
-----------------
(watchout for my zerk guide eta-1week).

 

[w.t.g]

Ok, i swapped angelics to raven+highlord, i am still looking for gore riders. Mind if i ask why you suggest leviathan instead of shaft? it would seem that levi got lower dr, and is missing life that shaft got.

One blizz sorc did 1 blizz and me, i took 2 hits and i lost huge amount of life, in nm. i just lack resistances so badly! ( i got raven on finger btw). I'll try to get those items that you listed! :lol:

-W.t.g

 

[rikstaker1]

Botdtmaul requires 192 strength.Levi is 174 & about +40-50 strength.So we can say it saves you 18 stat points.That means 18*4=72 life.Strength boosts your damage greatly in this case-T.maul receives 1.1% ed per strength point & being the most powerful weapon in the game-extra strength is welcome.So overall levi is a better choice,you've gotto look good too.

Shaft isn't bad by any means,but if you can afford levi,you should get it.

Razgriz

 

[w.t.g]

Botdtmaul requires 192 strength.Levi is 174 & about +40-50 strength.So we can say it saves you 18 stat points.That means 18*4=72 life.Strength boosts your damage greatly in this case-T.maul receives 1.1% ed per strength point & being the most powerful weapon in the game-extra strength is welcome.So overall levi is a better choice,you've gotto look good too.

Shaft isn't bad by any means,but if you can afford levi,you should get it.

Razgriz

Thx for replying! Mayby i'll try to get leviathan then, if i find decent percent one.
This barbarian can deal huge damage! i have 16k with merc atm. conc is 12k. I have 4.2k life, do u think it is enough? for PK'ing?
I used total 3 points (1+2 pre req.) for frenzy, i'l charce frenzy with bo weapons and then my zerk is ****** fast. Frenzy is for pk'ing/defending myself mostly.

-W.t.g :winner:

 

[rikstaker1]

erm..suggest you stay away from pvp-zerker isnt exactly built for pking.Anyway you can provide some entertainment to your opponents,if you choose not to.

Razgriz

 

[w.t.g]

erm..suggest you stay away from pvp-zerker isnt exactly built for pking.Anyway you can provide some entertainment to your opponents,if you choose not to.

Razgriz

Do you play HC? every1 baba pk'er is zerker, one or two handed. 2h is better vs casters. Sometimes (rarely) i've seen ww pk's, and i can tell you: they can't kill anything.

Do you feel that your life is in danger when frenzy zerker is running Ûber speed on ur direction, with enough damage to 1 hit kill you? :cheesy:

-W.t.g

 

[rikstaker1]

I dont play hardcore,if you are willing to take him then go ahead.

Razgriz

 

[w.t.g]

Merc Q

I am using might merc Atm, i was wondering if HF is better? HF+decp=ownage, in PvM and PvP, i will lose 2k max zerk damage tho :xlady:
What do you say? i personally think that HF might be better.

-W.t.g :xtree: