Logistics of Running Hell Meph

EatSleepDiablo1

New member
Dec 2, 2009
310
0
0
Logistics of Running Hell Meph

I have searched a number of threads on this topic, but none have been as comprehensive as I would like to discuss here. In short, I am looking to optimize my runs.

First, the runner is a dual tree sorc that uses moat trick and blizz primarily (FB for killing blow after switch only). Spell is at lvl 30 with CM at 23+-. She is equipped with full Tals, lidless (w/topaz), perfect chancies, rare 20FRW/25MF boots, soj, and rare FCR/15MF ring. Inventory is full of 6-7MF charms and 38MF Gheeds, excepting 2x3 area + 3x4 in cube. MF is 550+- with another 172 on switch.

Best times are 20 runs in 24 minutes (72 secs each on average), which includes three ATMA stash dumps. Runs that require more dumps obviously take longer, but that is why we run.

My typical run (at Players 3):

*Run to Ormus for recharge, then Cain to identify, then stash to dump, then to waypoint. 18-20+- secs.

*10 teleports to Lvl 3. 4+- secs.

*6-7 teleports to Meph. Picture half of a bell curve with Meph at the peak.

*I usually run left following the downside of the curve to draw Meph down. Teleporting is quicker, but he often charges right, or crosses the bridge to the portal. Neither is in my killing zone, which is the lower right section of the stairs.

*Once he follows, one teleport across the moat at 45 degree angle, and one to the brass colored, ornamental thingy along the right side. It is just outside Mephs range. Total run time is 35+- secs to this point.

*I generally use the balance of my mana globe casting consecutive blizzards in one of three spots—to the lower right and left of Meph (border of stairs/moat) and at the extreme upper left corner of my monitor. For my character, optimum damage is the width the “M” in Meph after the first cast, and one or all three spots are employed, depending on the corresponding damage. The randomness of the spell is perplexing, but I always start lower left, moving to the other two if results are disappointing. I always cast at least twice consecutively at each position, even if damage was poor with the first cast, because the second is usually better. 20-25+- secs here.

*Balance of time is item pickup, periodic ATMA dumps, and game exit/reloading.

Question for those who have read this far—what can be done to improve my speed? Are there better kill zones/techniques? Any tips are appreciated.

I am 500 runs into a 2,000+- sequence that equates to my 4,168 Pindle runs from time standpoint. I have had 661 S/U drops thus far, which needless to say blows him out of the water (450 in 4168 runs). I’ll post my results similar to before, along with a Flavie printout and obligatory screen shot. I’ll save the latter for Azurewrath should it drop. Meph dropped HC Shako last night and Arachs and Snowclash day before (actually in same drop). Still looking for Maras, Andarials, and, of course, AW. High probability that I’ll get one of the three anyway...
 
Last edited:
Re: Logistics of Running Hell Meph

I'm in too much of a rush to get into moat positioning technique, but here a couple things that jump out at me:

Why aren't you spamming FB between Blizzards? Running Meph with my Blizzballer, I spam either Ice Blast or FB (they seem to do about the same damage to Meph with her skills/equipment) between blizzards.

You have a very high MF, which is nice, but you have some MF in there that is fairly insignificant (considering diminishing returns) and could be replaced by stuff that could considerably increase your speed. You could replace your boots with something with 40 FRW (like Natalya's) to help you run quicker through the docks. There's also the option of Harmony bow on switch, but that would require a bigger MF sacrifice.

If you replace the Chance Guards with Magefist, and use either a perfect 35 FCR Spirit Shield (or an imperfect Spirit shield combined with your FCR ring) then you can hit the 105 FCR breakpoint, which will help you teleport to Meph faster and (if you spam something between blizzards) kill him faster.
 
Re: Logistics of Running Hell Meph

Roll a new durance map. Mine is 2 teleports.

Consider taking the red portal to act4 after you kill Meph. I'm not saying it's better and faster, but try it out, see if you like it.

I myself run with 2 tomes and a cube, and 1 small charm with 1 to strenght in my inventory. That lets me pickup rares. I like rares. They have stylepoints.

Back on topic: After I kill meph, I enter the red portal, immediatly S&E. The next run I have Cain identify my drops, and put S/U's in stash(I tend to pickup everything set and unique, thanks to some guy's shenanigans in an old IFT, where he said he confused ginther's rift with death's fathom :D). Anyway, I put the S/U's and set that I don't remember that I have and throw away the rest on the ground. That way if after a run I want to buy potions, I'll see items on the ground, and remember that Meph is allready dead in that game.

Hope this helps :)
 
Re: Logistics of Running Hell Meph

Re: Spamming FB between Blizzards?

I see your point, but it takes a boatload of FBs to make a dent in his life (at players 3). I generally click and hold blizz to ensure the max number of casts.

Re: You could replace your boots with something with 40 FRW.

Another good suggestion. The 25 MF in the rare boots is probably expendable.

Re: Chance Guards for Magefist, and Spirit for Lidless.

I do not have the strength for the latter without changing out some gear, but it is possible. Teleporting with an 80 cast rate is not too bad, but spamming FBs is another matter.

Although I'll lose 104 MF (25MFboots, 15MFring, 24MFshield, 40MFgloves), I'll see how it impacts my time.
 
Re: Logistics of Running Hell Meph

Roll a new durance map. Mine is 2 teleports

Considered it, but it only takes 4 secs at 10 teleports. Better maps are out there, but I have had much worse.

Re: red portal.

In Act 3, Cain is essentially on the way to Meph and stands right beside the stash. Do you use the red portal in case too much stuff drops?


 
Re: Logistics of Running Hell Meph

In MY opinion, a 35% FCR Spirit is a staple of any Sorc since it allows you to reach the very nice 105% breakpoint with Tal's + Spirit + Magefists (Or Oculus + Spirit + Partial Tal's + Magefists).
 
Re: Logistics of Running Hell Meph

I don't suppose you maximized Ice Blast as a Blizz synergy? With your fairly high CM, that might damage Meph faster than FB. Otherwise, some FBs are better than none, and if you put FB on LMB and Blizz on RMB then you can keep an eye on the cooldown and get a feel for the optimal number of FBs to spam between Blizzards without slowing down your blizzarding.
 
Re: Logistics of Running Hell Meph

Re: red portal.

In Act 3, Cain is essentially on the way to Meph and stands right beside the stash. Do you use the red portal in case too much stuff drops?

Cain is on the way to Meph, but those docks are huge. You can ping-pong back and forth to all the places you need in Act IV, and still make it to the waypoint faster than running the Kurast marathon.

As for dropping too much stuff, that's pretty much the only time I DON'T use the red portal, either keeping an item on my cursor (immediately followed by an ATMA dump), or because I need to town portal to store things, before returning to grab the rest (even then I SHOULD go to Act IV... I just get restless and think "This run is taking too long! Bail out! Bail out!")


 
Re: Logistics of Running Hell Meph

I don't suppose you maximized Ice Blast as a Blizz synergy? With your fairly high CM, that might damage Meph faster than FB. Otherwise, some FBs are better than none, and if you put FB on LMB and Blizz on RMB then you can keep an eye on the cooldown and get a feel for the optimal number of FBs to spam between Blizzards without slowing down your blizzarding.

I went the glacial spike route, maxing that instead.


 
Re: Logistics of Running Hell Meph

Couple of things I've noticed doing my Meph rund. (I'm sitting at 3044 atm.)

Players 1 is the way to go. You'll cut time off your run, and the loss in item drops isn't that noticble over a period of time.

Moat tricking is slow. I play a little more agressivly, mainly to keep it interesting. If you're using a prayer merc with insigh, shaftstop and rockstopper you should be able to grease meph before your merc dies. At 88, mine only dies once per hundred runs if I don't feed him a potion. (I've found my sorc take a dirtnap once every 300 or so runs, mainly becuase I get careless.)

Using a full blizz sorc for Mephing is nice. My usuall pattern looks like this.
Blizzard->static field->blizzard->iceblast->blizard->collect loot
If I improve my gear some more he'll be dead before the third blizz. As it is, he's usually dead within ten seconds of opening up on him.

+1 to leaving via the red portal. the distance to run to your stash and the teleport pad cuts down on time dramatically compared to dock running.
 
Re: Logistics of Running Hell Meph

Try to use TK to grab the waypoints.

When doing the moat trick try to pass at the round plataform to spawn the bone bridge so you can tele right to the portal after killing Meph.

If you tele right to the front of Meph when he's charging, he stops and tries to attack. Just quickly tele past the moat and he will try to follow. Blizz him away!

Personally I would ditch the MF switch for a Harmony bow. The vigor aura will speed up the time you spend in town, whatever is in act3 or act4.

Also full Tal is nice for Pits or WSK but Meph isn't dangerous, so I would use partial Tal (armor+belt+ammy), Occy (with an Ist if you can afford it), Spirit (perfect to hit the 65 FCR breakpoint with Occy) and Shako (Ptopaz).
 
Re: Logistics of Running Hell Meph

I have run Meph with a lot of different setups; P1, P3, pure Blizzard, dual-tree, 730% MF, 545% MF, etc. This is what I've found to be important.

1. Quick map is very nice. I have 2-3 teleports to get to the Durance 3 entrance.
2. Act 4 is quicker. Use Telekinesis to activate the WP right as you materialize (you have to move just a little bit in the direction of the WP first).
3. Pure blizzard is >>> than dual-tree for kill speed.
4. There is no reason to go higher than P3 for Meph. There is probably no reason to go higher than P1 for Meph (I found that P1 was the most efficient for me based on my times, MF, and expected drop rates)
5. Don't worry about MF on switch or from merc kills. If it doesn't slow you down, then take advantage of it. I found that it was taking me more time when I worried about things like that.
6. Meph has 50% cold resistance so you can get Cold Mastery up to level 27 before it stops helping your Blizzard power. The right balance between Cold Mastery and Synergy points is dependent on a lot of factors but if you're only worried about Mephisto and his 50% cold resistance, the maximum damage done by Blizzard is when your displayed Cold Mastery level is 8 points higher than the number of hard Blizzard synergies you have placed (up to a CM skill level of 27).

See this thread for some of my optimization experiences running Meph.

Post #36 was my starting gear.
Post #54 had a gear change (added that misidentified Ginther's Rift that Pijus mentioned a few posts back. Well, actually that one's big brother) :whistling:
Post #63 had a rebuild (got to 105% FCR)

My strategy when running Meph is to teleport to the circle area just beyond the red portal on Meph's side of the moat. That is far enough to draw him out but avoids having the vampires wake up. Then it's just drop Blizzard and spam Ice Blast (fire ball in your case) until he dies. Before I equipped the DF, I would teleport close enough to him to use Static Field as that was quicker but the DF sped things up so much that SF was no longer efficient.

Hope you get some good tips from this thread and have fun collecting goodies from Meph!
 
Re: Logistics of Running Hell Meph

6. Meph has 50% cold resistance so you can get Cold Mastery up to level 27 before it stops helping your Blizzard power.

As far as I know, Meph has 75% cold resistance, so you will need level 32 Cold Mastery to get him down to -100%.


 
Re: Logistics of Running Hell Meph

Um...You guys must have missed what Pijus said.

Re-roll the map so you can get one where the WP is as close to the stairwell to the Meph's clubhouse as possible.

Shoot for something like this...My Best Meph Map Ever!...but know that there are even better ones to be found.

Once you've got a good map, do what Ohomemgrande said (use the Act IV WP, etc.)
 
Re: Logistics of Running Hell Meph

If you're going to stay with running through Act3 instead of the red portal to Act4, definitely ditch the MF-switch and get FRW instead. A Harmony is ideal, but if you're not using the RW mod, then even a Zephyr is nice and cheap (Ort + Eth). If you go with the Red Portal though, then I think this matters less.

I've also stopped using the moat trick, and instead use a merc and go straight into battle once I've lured Meph down a little (to reduce the risk of Bloodlords showing up and helping Meph kick the merc's butt). I go with Guillaume's Face & Rattlecage on him for nice crushing blow (they're cheap items too). If you need mana an Insight can work for the weapon, but Kelpie Snare is better for keeping the merc alive.

One other thing I've noticed (for me) is Blizzard seems to miss A LOT more often if Meph retreats into the corner near the stairs. If necessary I always spend an extra second or two to make sure he's in the main open-space instead of right up against the corner. (To illustrate, the corner I'm talking about is where the cursor is in this screenshot, right next to my merc).

I'd also recommend rerolling to get a map that's 5 teleports or less on Durance2 (5 teleports is my self-imposed "limit" of where I'll keep a map or discard it). It really shouldn't take you more than 10 minutes (unless you're extremely unlucky) to get that good of a map. The last ~5 times I've had to roll a good Meph map such a map came up within ~5 minutes of searching, and a couple have been really good.
 
Re: Logistics of Running Hell Meph

One other thing I've noticed (for me) is Blizzard seems to miss A LOT more often if Meph retreats into the corner near the stairs. If necessary I always spend an extra second or two to make sure he's in the main open-space instead of right up against the corner. (To illustrate, the corner I'm talking about is where the cursor is in this screenshot, right next to my merc).

I've also experienced this. Now I know I wasn't imagining things. Keep him on the clear and never name lock with blizzard, aim slightly below.


 
Re: Logistics of Running Hell Meph

@albatross
That's good to hear - I wasn't sure if I was imagining it either. It's still possible we're both paranoid though. :D

And I've recently noticed about the namelocking too - I seem to get more hits out of Blizzards that weren't namelocked. I was even less certain about that than the stair-corner thing though, so I didn't mention it.
 
Re: Logistics of Running Hell Meph

I've noticed it, too. It seems the Blizzard spell doesn't "scrape" the walls very well so a mob standing near a wall escapes a lot of the damage. Same thing happens if you let Teh Pindeh and his posse get into the narrow part of the temple.
 
Re: Logistics of Running Hell Meph

@o1d_dude: On the minimap, do you see that wall to the right in your map screenshot? That's about where my entrance to durance 3 is :D

@Sirpoops: I noticed the corner thing too.
 
Re: Logistics of Running Hell Meph

I appreciate the suggestions all and implemented a few last night.

Increased my R/W, which helps, and the red portal shaves 15-20 secs off the front end of the run, although I give about half back with inventory management before S&E.

Tried TK waypoints. Will take a bit of getting use to.

No chance of wearing Spirt unless I ditch Tals. While Harly Crest and Occy are good alternatives, I spent too long finding Guardianship to give up on the set right now.

I am apprehensive about rerolling because the last bunch of maps I had were horrendous. For now, I'll optimize with the other tips and revist this later.

I have tried a couple gear setups with my merc, but not those you mentioned poops. I have an eth Kelpie in the kitty, so I should give it a try.

Players 1 saves a boatload of time, but I have to look at the economics of losing a drop, on average, per run. Not all those lost drops translate to a S/U, but if the difference needed to kill Meph is 10-15 sec, you get 16-25 more runs at p1 per 100 p3 runs.

So if my assumptions are correct, you lose 100 drops (on average) at p1, but gain 4.7 drops for the extra 16-25 runs (avg of 96). All else being equal, its a wash, although runs at p1 require fewer mana pots and less inventory management. +1 for players 1.

Thanks again for your help.
 
Last edited:
PurePremium
Estimated market value
Low
High