2017 Winter RFL Signup and Running Thread: 2nd Round

[Neksja]

Expected number of qualifiers in presented range for 30s p3 Travincal running over 20 hours:

Pul-Cham: 12.76
Vex-Cham: 4.19
Ber-Cham: 1.24

Also, it is cool to divide it like this:

Pul-Gul: 8.57
Vex-Sur: 2.95
Ber-Cham: 1.24

Good to know that my original goal of 10 qualifiers with 2 Vex+ were quite close to your calculations.

Here are betting odds for outright winner of RFL

Spoiler

Grape 2.20
NanoMist 4.00
Pb_pal 5.00
Neksja 6.50
Gripphon 7.00
Xios 10.00
tokerdin 10.00
Brak 15.00
Burgomaster 15.00
ILikeRocks 15.00
Everyone else 20+

To have winner from Grape-NanoMist-Pb_pal triangle: 1.49 (aka 67% chance or 2/3)

5 pgems for NanoMist winning the whole thing.


And @Burgomaster3 please continue to slow down with Vex runes, 5x Vex Top5 is not gonna even crack top8 in this round anyway, so thank you for giving the rest of us a chance to take this round

 

[srrw]

................................................
Grape
Neksja
XyleneCyanol
T72on1
ffs
Lynchgrinch
Gripphon
Brak
Xios
Pb_pal
NanoMist
Burgomaster3
Chaostar
ILikeRocks
DaveW
mir
maxicek
Southpaw8668
PhineasB
Tokerdin
srrw

Diablo2inDC (1.07)
----------------------------

I *might* be able to run. We'll see.

 

[Lynchgrinch]

@Burgomaster3

Thanks for the detailed reply! I've got quite a few of those items you mentioned...I guess I'll make a Travi Barb then!

 

[pharphis]

I had a dream where I found a 1.07 zod at RoF superchests.. should have realized I was dreaming right then

 

[tokerdin]

@tokerdin This here is an excellent guide about WW Barbarians in Travincal, and it should answer most of your questions. I can add few suggestions:

1. You should really learn to use Hotkeys. Most players map the skill keys to QWER/ASDF/ZXCV etc. for easier skill selection. You can of course continue to use F1-F12, but even then, you should always use the keyboard for skill selection, never the mouse.

2. With Barb, you should use the hurtier weapon as primary one, that is, the one above gloves. If you cannot afford another Grief, consider making Oath runeword, it will be a considerable upgrade to the rare. Try and look for 4 socket ethereal Balrog Blade or Colossus Sword for base.

3. Level up. Play the game at least until you've rescued Anya, then do Pindleruns on /players8 until you're at least level 85+, shouldn't take too long. With lower levels, you have trouble hitting the Council and your merc doesn't stand a chance.

4. Use mercenary. Act 2 Nightmare Offensive merc (the one with Might aura) is really the only option you should be looking at. Arm him with Reaper's Toll for the Decrepify. Guardian Angel is a good armor for him, so is Gladiator's Bane, Fortitude works also. For headgear, Kira's Guardian and Steel Shade work the best imo. Socket the merc's gear with things that give fire resists and IAS.

5. If you can make Enigma, make Enigma and use it. It will pay itself back in no time.

6. Ditch the Ravenfrost. You don't really need CBF for WW Barb, and the cold damage will shatter corpses, meaning you cannot hork them. Look for rare/craft with ll/fcr/ar/res instead.

Hope this helps. Good luck!

***

Rolling maps with Sorceress and it's as tedious as I imagined. It probably doesn't hepl, that I'm picky and don't accept any maps where I can't teleport under the "magical line". Things would go faster if I didn't feel the urge to kill the Council so often. But how can I not when they keep rewarding me so handsomely:

The Stone of Jordan
Ring
Required Level: 29
Fingerprint: 0xc69e3710
Item Level: 85
Version: Expansion 1.10+
Unidentified
+1 to All Skills
Adds 1 - 12 Lightning Damage
+20 to Mana
Increase Maximum Mana 25%

Also found Mal, and Pul with the Barb earlier. God I hope it will be this steady going when the real action starts (it never is).

hey thanks for the help and link. i really should have done my reading before using my other LO rune on a fort (especially a superior one with durability).

I really should work on the hotkeys you are right about that right now i just keep 2 hot keys and set Z to cycle between skills

I have both a colossus sword and barlog blade eth 4 soc which would you recommend for oath?

Once i make enigma lvling and a patriarch Snickers will be top priority.

yeah ill switch back to the act 2 might kindof a waste of a ber rune in the wrath but ill find some use for it lol

yeah kicking myself in the ass for not just making the enigma from the get go i just wish i had a jah rune i hate to take 3 bers to make enigma but i do have plenty of ber runes lol

Thats good news on the CBF for WW ill have to look through my rare rings again


nice finds i still dont have any SOJs almost a year into playing again of corse that was part of the reason to make a trav barb.

 

[Burgomaster3]

And @Burgomaster3 please continue to slow down with Vex runes, 5x Vex Top5 is not gonna even crack top8 in this round anyway, so thank you for giving the rest of us a chance to take this round

inorite? No way one can get to top 8 with anything lower than Lo in their top 5, and I'm trying to compete with all these useless Vexes and Ohms in my pocket. Not fair really.

I should probably stop for a while. I feel I'm testing my luck.

Might as well. I rolled maps with my Barb and came up with pretty good one, with all the Council members in the balcony, but not as scattered as with my previous one. Timed 50 test runs and came up with average of 39.680s. That's almost 3 seconds faster than my previous time, and I'm still whirling like an idiot. Fastest time was 35.3s, anything that went over 40 seconds felt really slow. Also had couple of disastrous 55+ second runs where I made mistakes that shouldn't really happen. If I get that sorted out, I'm positive I could be looking at sub 38s averages.

Of course, the drop flooding is a nightmare and it's very possible I'll miss some potentially nice stuff during hundreds of runs. Still, with these run time I still have time to somewhat carefully check the drops. I'm also checking and sometimes picking up stuff while half of the Council is still alive, so that speeds up the end of the run. If I went with strictly "wysiwyg"-style, I'd probably get averages down to 36 seconds or something, but that's testing my peace of mind.

So, my runners are basically good to go. I'm still contemplating about rerolling the Sorcs map, and might do some minor equipment tweaking for both chars, but at the moment, I'm pretty happy where I stand.

@Lynchgrinch One solid WW weapon I forgot to mention: Tomb Reaver. Especially if you have 3os one.

@tokerdin I'd go with Colossus Sword, it has higher avg damage, and is still able to reach max attack speed with both whirlwind and berserk.

 

[D2DC]

Lets bet on pgems! Hype.

@Gripphon - I'll bet 1pg on @pharphis (If he's still running) Round 2 Ber, and Round 3 Jo! Game over!

 

[Pb_pal1]

You guys are nuts betting against the Zod God himself in a rune-finding tournament. There are higher powers at work here!

10 PGems on Grape.

As for preditcions for this round:

1st: Gripphon
2nd: Grape
3rd: Nanomist
4th: T72on1
5th: Neskja

I don't expect to finish very high myself (though that IS what I said last time ). I've never run Trav seriously (or basically at all) before, but I did manage to roll a decent map finally, although the council members could stand to be a bit tighter together.

Some awesome info flying around in this thread too, will be interesting to see how the different strategies pan out. The HYPE is real!

 

[pharphis]

Probably not a worthwhile bet since I'll definitely be doing less than 20 hr

 

[Grape1]

I'd bet for someone who is running more than one batch (and is somewhat efficient).

As for myself, I try to squeeze a decent one batch and let it be. Though I may find it hard if the first batch isn't that good. Let's see.

Little tip for Sorc runners: if you find your mana/life/res/whatever numbers are good enough, consider dropping some small charms away for more space. This will let you run for longer periods before needing a stashing break. Works for me at least, since what fills the space the fastest is those gems and they take a 1x1 each. I just find it more meaningful to run a little longer, though ofc one can stop the counter whenever muling stuff off, but that always cuts the pace little bit.

View attachment 4803
Should probably throw that tome away too.

 

[T72on1]

If I want speed, I always run without a cube. Yes, it's more space, but I find I'm loosing time opening inventory to put things in it when I find them, and then in town have to open and close it a few times to drop any unwanted items. That's probably not the right thing to do though, as a lot of people seem faster then me.

I decided to ditch more mf yesterday, in favor of more mana, by switching Chance Guards with Frostburns. Got up from 1050 mana to some 1250, which made a big difference again. No more mana potions needed at all. I also switched out my isted Shako for one with a cold facet, although that won't make much difference in the end probably. Found my second Tal's amulet now that I had some 65% mf less, so I consider that a good sign ...

 

[Burgomaster3]

I always run with 4x4 free space, without cube, with both the Barb and Sorc. Less free space than that feels uncomfortable to me. I tried Sorc with two skillers more (7 total) and it had no influence in my runtimes (in fact they were a bit worse).

I feel I'm in at a bit of a sweet spot with the Sorc, where extra +skills don't do much. Blizzard is at level 38, damage with +25%csd Fathom is 8199-8534. I tried 1.07 Shako combined with SoJ (other ring is 1.13 BKWB) but didn't like it. The extra life didn't quite bring the same safety as Dwarf Star, and the extra skill point from SoJ did nothing. I tested 1.07 Shako+Dwarf Star but then mana started to feel like a problem. So now I'm back with 1.13 Shako and Dwarf Star and it feels really comfortable.

@T72on1 1250 mana seems a tad bit overkill. I have 836 mana after BO and I rarely run under 500 during the runs, and only very rarely do I have to drink pots. Your runs aren't much slower than mine, where does all your mana go?

As for MF, I try to be somewhere between 180-200 (sorc is at 183, barb at 194 atm), really don't feel more than that is necessary. Unique jewelry drops often enough, set jewelry almost every run, rare rings everywhere. During 200 test runs i found two facets, Shako, Wolfhowl and probably something else I forgot, and I feel that's pretty basic luck, based on my experiences in the past. More MF would probably help if you are really hurting for unique jewelry or, I don't know, Wizardspikes, but I wouldn't go there if it costs speed/safety.

 

[T72on1]

@Burgomaster3 When the council members die fast, 850 mana would probably be enough. Problem is that, more often than not, I still have to kill stragglers by starting to spam Ice Blast. Then mana starts to drain rapidly, and I end up needing more pots than I'd want.

I'll have to test my setup with 2 skillers less. Right now I only leave 2x4 free, the rest are all skillers and small charms. I might end up being faster by leaving out 2 skillers and having more free space. I'll do some test runs in such a setup soon.

 

[Burgomaster3]

You use Static Field right? Because I spam Ice Blast as well, and still feel 850 mana is enough. Care to share your gear?

Maybe it's a map thing. I can see mana being a problem if you have to hunt more than 4 council members around, but if that's the case, I would just roll new map. Of course it might be quality-of-life thing for you. I do have to drink mana potion now and then, but they are easy to replenish by TK'ing from the drops, no need to visit Jamella.

I just tried few test runs with HotO instead of Fathom (had to bring in two dex charms so I could equip it lol) and didn't really notice much difference, mana usage or damage wise. Had to drink one mana pot because I screwed up BO trying to be all fast and stuff. 10 runs I clocked in 24.888 average with pretty basic running, and I can't really see that changing much. The difference Fathom makes seems to be minimal indeed compared to the difference good map makes. And my map isn't even perfect.

 

[T72on1]

Gear is Shako (Isted or with facet, used both, but don't see much difference), Mara's, CoH, HotO, Spirit, Dwarf Star, rare ring with resists and mana, Arachnid's, War Traveler and Frostburn (before that Chance Guards). Inventory all skillers, small charms with mf and/or mana. Merc uses Guardian Angel, Infinity and Kira's.

My map is very good I think. All council members pretty tight at the left side of the balcony. Always one shrine next to the waypoint, often a second one next to the balcony, which I can tk while killing the Council. Skill routine usually is Blizzard / Static x3 / Blizzard / spam Ice Blast until everything is dead.

From my CS runs between 97 and 98, I always had the impression that it's best not to use Ice Blast or Glacial early on, because you want monsters to keep moving, through your Blizzard, to take more damage. Hence my skill routine. I felt it worked best in CS, and also have the feeling it works best in Travincal. But maybe I should try a batch of a few hours without it and see if there's any difference.

I also think that positioning is really important. I used to teleport further to the right, but during a one hour session a few hours ago, I payed attention to land on the balcony quite close to the Council members. I had the impression I was killing them quicker that way. Average running time went down from the usual 28 sec to 27 sec. What lowers my average running time significantly are trips in town where I need to id and stash. I hope that, by freeing up more inventory space to at least 4x4, I can bring my run times down, hopefully close to 25 sec.

 

[Gripphon1]

I can confirm blizzard damage does not play that much of a role in running speed.
These tests are done with a goldfind sorc which has:
1814 life
900 mana
4480-4716 blizzard damage

With average of ~22 seconds including stash visiting (but NOT collecting gold this time, just standard running). Fully decked out sorc is ~19s, aka 16% faster, but with twice as much blizzard damage. Difference between 9500 damage blizzard and 7000 should be pretty small overall. This is why Fathom is not really needed for sorc, but might mean half second or up to second faster runtimes at best.

 

[ffs]

I've also been trying different blizz sorc setups, with blizzard damage anywhere between 5k and 11k. I do feel there is definitely a sweet spot somewhere around the 8-9k mark. However, hitting this damage range does make a considerable difference at least on my map, where they are clumped but not in the corner, and it enables me to kill them before they spread out. So for me it does improve runtimes noticeably because I very rarely have to snipe some lone random council member that way.

I never had that perfect "everything in the left corner" map on a sorc, and I can imagine on such a map you can get away with lower blizzard damage. Maybe I should reroll my map and hope I can get a good one until round 2 starts, but I actually really like it.. aaand I'm feeling lazy.

But in general I'm not even sure why go for anything else than highest possible damage with decent survivability anyway. Question is really, what's the alternative? Not a fan of running Trav for MF (unless in need of RBFs), so no point in sacrificing anything for MF gear. Goldfind of course is another story but for the purposes of this tournament I don't really plan to pick up a lot of gold. So full on damage it is! Probably 63% fcr with with Fathom, Nightwing's (horrible roll though), Snowclash (love it!) woop woop.

 

[Gripphon1]

One possible upgrade to sorc came up to me, but will have to test it first.

@ffs

There is usefulness for some MF in Travincal. It is a great place to farm rare rings, rare jewels and facets along with unique rings and amulets. I'd say that qualifies it as good MF target, but with limited MF - sweet spot is around 170 MF. Unless someone is more into unique stuff than rare. This is why some players value Shako higher than Nightwing's (mana too!) because extra dmg from Nightwing's is rather poor upgrade, while MF bonus from Shako is a nice bonus.

Also talking about sweet spot of blizzard damage, I tried sorc with near 14k, and then current sorc with 9k. Actually have beaten 14k dmg with 9k a little, but kinda temporal fluctuation than a fact. They are kinda similar regarding damage output it seems.

 

[ffs]

I don't think I could ever get anywhere close to 14k but it's comforting to know it doesn't make a big difference.

 

[Burgomaster3]

@T72on1 Yeah, it doesn't look like there's anything wrong with your map. Or gear or playstyle for that matter. My routine is very similar. Blizzard - Static- Blizzard - Ice Blast. I usually Blast one or two times right in front of me, in case there's a Council member that has it in for me, then I try to snipe whoever I think will possibly be alive after the second blizzard. I also continue throwing blizzards until every one is dead. It happens quite often, that I spam IB at a minion, then throw a blizzard and the minion dies before the IB hits it. So it's good to keep the blizzard cycle going until every enemy is down. But I imagine this is pretty much how everyone does it, there are only so many ways to Blizzard.

Maybe your preference for high mana comes from the fact that you used to run with Insight merc instead of Infinity? Well, you got the glove spot to spare, so why not. Only variation that comes to mind, is to replace Frostburns with Hellmouth and then switch Dwarf Star for SoJ/BKWB. That might or might not make a difference.

Teleporting as close as the Council as you can is a good idea, since that way they don't scatter so much, and also, it's easier for you to pick up stuff while you're still killing stuff, without needing to reposition the merc. I'm thinking about switching for Cham'd Shako for this reason.

I don't usually ID stuff in-game much, it's easier just to do that later in GoMule. Often I just go straight to GoMule once my inventory is full, since my stash tends to be full of gems. Sometimes I pick up ID scrolls the Council drops and ID right there in Travincal.

@ffs Well, I might put the question other way: If extra damage doesn't help you, why not go for extra survivability and MF instead? I've tested Nightwing+Snowclash combo (instead of Shako+Arachnid), and for ~1300 damage (and cold absorb which may or may not be useful) I lose ~150 life, ~200 mana, 10%dr, 74MF, 1 casting frame and a point of Static Field. The extra damage has next to no impact on my run times. Instead, I run into mana problems more often, and overall my character feels less sturdy. This is no problem when I'm doing hundred runs or so, but when I'm planning to do thousands, I find the extra safety actually makes me faster. Once in a while, things go sideways, and when they do, I'm happy I have the right gear for it.

But that is of course a matter of taste. If the Council is going fast and you're not, there is nothing you're doing wrong. Actually, for Fathomless setup, the NWV+Snowclash might work better, since there you get some extra mana from HotO + can use Magefists and still reach 105fcr, and you probably benefit more from the extra damage.

And the reasonable amount of MF comes quite easily, especially if you go with Shako, so no big sacrifices necessary. Rare rings are a pretty good reason to have somewhat respectable amount of MF: Nearly all the rings I considered when I was equipping my WWer (and the ones I ended up using), had an item level of 85, which means they most likely came from Travincal. And they were some nice rings indeed. Wouldn't mind me some more of those.